October 2002 - Fractint - mailman.xmission.com

Re: [Fractint] Re: Fractint on XP
by nick.grasso＠hrads.com 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

Hans-Joachim wrote: >>>As far as running makefcfg is concerned, you're, of course, right, I did run it in Virtual PC DOS. Obviously, that's the way to do it. (But I haven't figured out why some resolutions could not be generated. You would have expected to be able to see these resolutions on a S3 card, right?)<<< Hello Hans-Joachim, Yes, I would have expected this to work and I'm sorry to hear that it doesn't because I had hoped to run fractint at 1600x1200 under Virtual PC. Maybe it's just a problem with the makecfg program? Maybe if you knew the correct parameters, you could enter them into fractint.cfg by hand? I'm sure that the S3 does support 1600x1200. Do you have any other DOS apps that use 1600x1200 that you could try? I just got my new scanner yesterday and got it working this morning. This was the last thing that was keeping me from upgrading to XP. I am probably still a few weeks away from completing the upgrade and trying Virtual PC, but of course I will post my findings when I do. Nick

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Re: [Fractint] Re: Fractint on XP
by Hans-Joachim Metzger 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

Nick, thanks for your useful remarks on VMware and Virtual PC 5.0. Maybe I'll give 5.0 a try - with a trial version first. As far as running makefcfg is concerned, you're, of course, right, I did run it in Virtual PC DOS. Obviously, that's the way to do it. (But I haven't figured out why some resolutions could not be generated. You would have expected to be able to see these resolutions on a S3 card, right?) Hans-Joachim > Did you run makecfg in Virtual PC DOS? I'm almost certain that is the correct > thing to do. The VESA modes on your NVidia don't matter at all in Virtual PC. It > simulates all the DOS/VESA graphics in software (using DirectX). It simulates an > S3 card, so Fractint thinks it is running on an S3. Has anybody written a > fractint cfg entry for 1600x1200 for the S3? > You should try Virtual PC 5.0. Many people complained that version 4 was slow > and they claim to have greatly speeded it up in version 5. > VMware is very similar to Virtual PC in the way it works. They concentrate more > on enterprise features, e.g., they have better support for networks and SCSI > devices. It also costs $100 more. However, I don't think their DOS support is as > good. They may not support VESA or SVGA at all. It is unclear from their web > site. _______________________________________________ Fractint mailing list Fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint ----------------------- Internet Header -------------------------------- Sender: fractint-admin(a)mailman.xmission.com Received: from mailman.xmission.com (mailman.xmission.com [198.60.22.29]) by siaag2ad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.18) with ESMTP id NAA10531; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 13:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=mailman.xmission.com) by mailman.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 182E0w-0007Yy-00; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 11:00:50 -0600 Received: from [65.170.34.101] (helo=hrads.com) by mailman.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 182Dzh-0006Lb-00 for <fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com>; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 10:59:33 -0600 Received: from [100.100.1.17] (HELO svr_notes.hrads.com) by hrads.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with SMTP id 1502947 for fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:59:01 -0400 Received: by svr_notes.hrads.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.7 (934.1 12-30-1999)) id 85256C55.005D529F ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:59:19 -0400 X-Lotus-FromDomain: GBE From: nick.grasso(a)hrads.com To: fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com Message-ID: <85256C55.005D5146.00(a)svr_notes.hrads.com> Subject: Re: [Fractint] Re: Fractint on XP Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Sender: fractint-admin(a)mailman.xmission.com Errors-To: fractint-admin(a)mailman.xmission.com X-BeenThere: fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: fractint(a)mailman.xmission.com List-Help: <mailto:fractint-request@mailman.xmission.com?subject=help> List-Post: <mailto:fractint@mailman.xmission.com> List-Subscribe: <http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint>, <mailto:fractint-request@mailman.xmission.com?subject=subscribe> List-Id: Fractint and General Fractals Discussion <fractint.mailman.xmission.com> List-Unsubscribe: <http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint>, <mailto:fractint-request@mailman.xmission.com?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://mailman.xmission.com/pipermail/fractint/> Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:59:16 -0400 <

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Re: [Fractint] Why are we still holding on to Fractint?
by BillatNY＠aol.com 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

I write formulas using the function variables fn1 - fn4. It's then very easy to simply hit Z and keep plugging in different functions and seeing what happens. I can try hundreds of combinations in a relatively short time. Bill Rossi <A HREF="http://members.aol.com/billatny">http://members.aol.com/billatny</A> <A HREF="http://www.arts4u.org/rossi">http://www.arts4u.org/rossi</A>

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FOTD 16 Oct 2002
by John Lewis 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

Why should Mandlebrot object? :-) John -- John Lewis, jlewis(a)clara.net on 17/10/2002

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Why are we still holding on to Fractint?
by Lee Skinner 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

<< I'd like to hear some you other fractolieri's reasons for remaining <<with fractint. Its browser. Lee

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Why are we still holding on to Fractint?
by Bill Jemison 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

<< I'd like to hear some you other fractolieri's reasons for remaining <<with fractint. It's music/sound capabilities. Bill

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Re: [Fractint] Why are we still holding on to Fractint?
by nick.grasso＠hrads.com 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

Tony Parker wrote: >>>It's interesting that there is still a significant group of folk who still prefer using fractint to "create" fractal images, rather than moving on "completely" to UF 2/3. I'd like to hear some you other fractolieri's reasons for remaining with fractint.<<< Well, UF is a great program with many features that fractint doesn't have. However, fractint has features that are missing in UF. One that immediately comes to mind is fractint's support for orbit fractals, e.g., pickover and icons, which I really like. Also, I like the ability to switch resolutions. For example, I run Windows at 1152x864 but I often like to see fractals at 1600x1200. I think it is possible for a Windows program to do this by using DirectX, but I don't think UF supports it. I have just recently downloaded the UF 3 evaluation and am not too familiar with it, so my comments are based on ver. 2. Nick

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Re: [Fractint] Re: Fractint on XP
by nick.grasso＠hrads.com 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

Hans-Joachim Metzger wrote: >>>I've been experimenting with running Virtual PC 4.3 under XP to find out whether or not I'd be able to make full use of my Pentium4 2 GHz/512 MB RAM machine to accelerate Fractint fractal calculations.<<< Thank you for posting your experience with Virtual PC! I have not yet tried it, but I have a few comments. >>>Having applied the makefcfg utility to sort out possible VESA problems with my NVidia GeForce4 MX 460 graphics card, I have been able to generate the following resolutions for Fractint (running under DOS under Virtual PC under Windows XP):<<< Did you run makecfg in Virtual PC DOS? I'm almost certain that is the correct thing to do. The VESA modes on your NVidia don't matter at all in Virtual PC. It simulates all the DOS/VESA graphics in software (using DirectX). It simulates an S3 card, so Fractint thinks it is running on an S3. Has anybody written a fractint cfg entry for 1600x1200 for the S3? >>>Even calculations of 640x480x256 fractals turned out to be considerably slower than on my Pentium III 700 and 800 MHz PCs. Maybe, there is a way to reconfigure DOS under Virtual PC. I have applied old autoexec.bat and config.sys values from way back when I was really still using DOS, but could not achieve any signficant accelerations.<<< You should try Virtual PC 5.0. Many people complained that version 4 was slow and they claim to have greatly speeded it up in version 5. >>>Has anyone ever tried VMware Workstation? Since it is a virtual machine software letting you run multiple operating systems (like, for instance, Windows and Linux) on a single piece of hardware, maybe it is more useful for running Fractint on modern machines than Virtual PC is.<<< VMware is very similar to Virtual PC in the way it works. They concentrate more on enterprise features, e.g., they have better support for networks and SCSI devices. It also costs $100 more. However, I don't think their DOS support is as good. They may not support VESA or SVGA at all. It is unclear from their web site. Nick

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FOTD 17-10-02 (Mandel Fragments [5])
by Jim Muth 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

FOTD -- October 17, 2002 (Rating 5) Fractal visionaries and enthusiasts: There has been a notable lack of critical thinking in the Fractal Central area lately. Critical thinking is what skeptics, as well as fractalists, do so much of, and what believers in unlikely things do so little of. Those who think critically will explain events as simply and rationally as possible. They will not use questionable phenomena such as mental telepathy as an explanation when a normal explanation such as somehow receiving the information through the senses will work as well. There is a good reason for this -- the simplest, most reasonable, explanation is most often the right one. A rash of shootings have taken place in the area lately, and the sniper has so far eluded capture. To me, the explanation is simple -- most likely a very clever maniac is on the loose, or possibly it is the beginning of the next phase of foreign terrorism in the U.S. The shootings are almost certainly not some of the things I have been hearing, such as the beginning of an alien invasion from outer space, or a racist plot to make the ethnically-mixed police department look bad, or a plot to swing the upcoming election in favor of the candidate who wants tighter gun control. I doubt that the shootings are the begin- ning of Armageddon, as I have heard one woman very seriously claim. I wonder how long it will be before the psychics appear on the scene with so many different explanations that one of them is certain to be correct. Oh, we have a fractal today. I named it "Mandel Fragments" because of its extremely fragmentary nature. The generating expression combines various negative portions of Z^(-1.2) and Z^(-11.7). The fractal is then turned outside-in by adding 1/C instead of just plain C. The midget at the center of today's image is a third-order one, lying near the southeast border of a larger midget that lies in the East Valley area of a still larger midget, which in turn lies in a valley of the parent, which consists of oversized but scattered Mandeloid figures. Try as I might, I could see nothing in the final product that is above the long-term FOTD average. I therefore rated it at an average 5. The unreasonably long render time of 1-3/4 hours does nothing to raise the image out of the realm of the mundane. But do not give up hope of seeing the image. Relief will soon arrive in the form of the finished GIF image, which will be available on the FOTD web sites as soon as Paul and Scott can render it. Paul's site may be accessed at: <http://home.att.net/~Paul.N.Lee/FotD/FotD.html> and Scott's at: <http://sdboyd.dyndns.org/~sdboyd/fotd/index.html> The fractal weather Wednesday featured, if it could be called a feature, heavy rain, strong winds, and a temperature of 57F 14C. The cats seemed to know early that it would not be an outdoor day, and satisfied themselves watching the raindrops trickle down the windows. Surprisingly, the sun did break through late in the afternoon, though it was still too wet outside for the dynamic duo's paws. Today is beginning much more pleasantly, both for man and cats. The sun is shining, it is warmer, and the amount of work to be done is reasonable. I think it might be a good day. Until tomorrow, take care, and beware of the fractal conspiracy. Jim Muth jamth(a)mindspring.com jimmuth(a)aol.com START 20.0 PAR-FORMULA FILE================================ Mandel_Fragments { ; time=1:47:58.14--SF5 on a P200 reset=2002 type=formula formulafile=allinone.frm formulaname=MandelbrotMix4 function=recip passes=1 center-mag=+0.56720708891643850/-0.004432614125375\ 13/9.794662e+010/1/35/-0.000417907618523220836 params=7/-1.2/0.7/-11.7/-1.5/800 float=y maxiter=14400 inside=0 periodicity=10 colors=0001MA0M80M72N93OA5PB6QD8RE9SFATGCUIDVJFWKG\ WLIXNJYOKgPM_QN`SPaTQbUScVTdXUdYWeZXf`Zga_hbaicbje\ ckfKcXgmkiomkqomsqntspuurvwswxvxywxzyyzzyzzzzzzz7_\ WuxutxusxtsxtrxsrxsqxrpxrpxqoxqoxpFWUmxomxoFWUlxnk\ ymjymjyliylhykhykgyjgyjfyieyieyhdyhdygcygbyfbyfaye\ ayecxcdwbevafv`guZhtYjsXksWlrVmqTnqSopRqoQrnOsnNtm\ MulLvlKukLukLtjMtjMtiNsiNsiOrhOrhPrgPqgQqfQpfRpfRp\ eSoeSodTndTncUncUmcUmbVlbVlaWlaWk`Xk`Xj`Yj_Yj_ZiZZ\ iZ_hY_hY`hY`gXagXafWbfWbfWbdXacYaaZa`Z`__`Y``X``Va\ _Ub_Tc_Rc_QdZOeZNeZMfZKgYJhYIhYGiYFjXDjXCkXBlX9mW8\ mW6nW5oWFaV2pV1qV0qV1pW2oW3nW4mW4lW5kW6jW7iX7hX8gX\ 9fXAYXBdXBcXCcYDbYEaYE`YF_YGZYHYYHXYIWZJVZKUZLTZLS\ ZMRZNQZOQ_OP_PO_QN_RM_SL_SK_TJ`UI`VH`VG`WF`XE`YD`Y\ D`_GX`JUbMRcPOdSLfUIgXFh_Cjb9ke6lg3hb9eYEbTKZOPWKV\ TF_PAeM5jJ1oL3mM5kN6jO8hP9gRBeSCdTEbUGaVH_WJZYKXZM\ W_NU`PUaRUbSUcTUcUUcUUcUU } frm:MandelbrotMix4 {; Jim Muth a=real(p1), b=imag(p1), d=real(p2), f=imag(p2), g=1/f, h=1/d, j=1/(f-b), z=(-a*b*g*h)^j, k=real(p3)+1, l=imag(p3)+100, c=fn1(pixel): z=k*((a*(z^b))+(d*(z^f)))+c, |z| < l } END 20.0 PAR-FORMULA FILE==================================

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Re: [Fractint] Re: Fractint on XP
by Hans-Joachim Metzger 17 Oct '02

17 Oct '02

I've been experimenting with running Virtual PC 4.3 under XP to find out whether or not I'd be able to make full use of my Pentium4 2 GHz/512 MB RAM machine to accelerate Fractint fractal calculations. Having applied the makefcfg utility to sort out possible VESA problems with my NVidia GeForce4 MX 460 graphics card, I have been able to generate the following resolutions for Fractint (running under DOS under Virtual PC under Windows XP): 640x400x256 640x480x256 800x600x256 1024x768x256 1280x1024x256 With lower or higher resolutions (specified by makefcfg in my fractint.cfg), Virtual PC hung up. I also managed to generate the above resolutions for true colour modes. So, yes, as far as video modes are concerned Virtual PC might be a way to work around the XP limitations. But, there is a but - at least for me. Even calculations of 640x480x256 fractals turned out to be considerably slower than on my Pentium III 700 and 800 MHz PCs. Maybe, there is a way to reconfigure DOS under Virtual PC. I have applied old autoexec.bat and config.sys values from way back when I was really still using DOS, but could not achieve any signficant accelerations. That's why I have given up on trying to run the current Fractint DOS version under XP on my 2 GHz machine. I've decided to wait and hope and pray for the Windows version. Otherwise I'm fine with Fractint on my other PCs (running Windows 98 and ME). Hans-Joachim PS: Something else comes to mind while reporting these experiences with Virtual PC. Has anyone ever tried VMware Workstation? Since it is a virtual machine software letting you run multiple operating systems (like, for instance, Windows and Linux) on a single piece of hardware, maybe it is more useful for running Fractint on modern machines than Virtual PC is.

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