April 2009 - Utah-Astronomy - mailman.xmission.com

Orion Astrographs
by Patrick Wiggins 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

Anyone notice Orion is now selling RC astrographs? http://www.telescope.com/control/category/~category_id=astro- imaging_scopes/~pcategory=astro-imaging patrick

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] member loaner scope vs school subsidy
by Wayne Sumner 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

All are excellent suggestions, Erik, but notice that they all hinge on the willingness of individuals like yourself to give more of your time and talents! More power to all of you who are so willing. Wayne A. Sumner Math/Physics/Astronomy/Engineering Boy's Tennis Coach Northridge High School Davis School District (801) 402-8610 >>> <erikhansen(a)TheBlueZone.net> 04/16/09 10:00 AM >>> >Wayne, I wonder if there is something other than providing telescopes that can be done. You make a clear point that what is needed is interest from teachers. Perhaps what is needed is more leadership from the Universities Astronomy and Physics Dept. SLAS could play a role but I doubt it is a leading role. You also make a good point that we should not run faster than we are able. We do seem close to that with the number of Star Parties (it is hard to find an astro club that does more) we support. Perhaps that is all we are capable of, personally I feel we should promote our public star parties more in the public school system. I personally would be willing to operate the Grim for school groups. Also, perhaps all we need do is tell teachers who contact us that we have some resources to give them as far as acquiring educational material. Perhaps we will encounter someone as enthusiastic as yourself. Perhaps the best SLAS could do is acquire an inventory of programs available from the Astronomical Society of the Pacific (for example), as Jay eluded to, and make them available to the schools. These could also be utilized in for club meetings. Erik I have been keenly interested in this discussion of the SLAS telescope > loaner program because I am both a long time purveyor of school star > parties (I estimate I've personally done about 500 since 1981), and, since > 2001, have been a high school teacher of math, physics, engineering, and > astronomy. > Many of you, I'm sure, recall the Iomega Astronomy Enrichment program > that Brent Watson and I conducted in the 1990's. With $50,000 from > Iomega, and additional other funding sources such as Eisenhower grants, > we build and placed about 320 6 inch f-10 telescopes in schools > scattered over most of Utah and nearby corners of Idaho and Wyoming. > We conducted workshops for groups of carefully selected teachers to > give them the rudements of amateur astronomy, a working knowledge of > telescopes, and a beginning understanding of the night sky. > We are still very proud of that effort, and I frequently encounter > teachers who either are still using those telescopes or want > information, help, and training on how to use telescopes they inherited > from predecessors. Yes, a few ended up as "trophy" telescopes (you > know what I mean... they end up as impressive conversation pieces or > classroom decorations, but never see starlight), and a few have ended > up in storage rooms with lost or damaged eyepieces and mirrors covered > with mouse poop and urine (yes, we've actually seen that, too). The > feedback I get, however, is that most of them are still actually in > use, being checked out to students who take them home or used at school > star parties. > Towards the end of the 1990's, however, we found it harder and harder > to recruit teachers to participate in our program. We came to the > conclusion that the supply had pretty much met the demand. Teachers > who wanted telescopes and were willing to put them to good use had > them. Brent and I were both disappointed at the apparent lack of > interest on the part of so many teachers. We realized that our goal of > placing a telescope in every elementary school was not realistic. > Having said all that, I have to agree with those who realize that the > scope of SLAS's outreach programs has to be limited by the resources > available (loaner telescopes and precious member time) to those willing > to join their time and interests with those of SLAS. Don't feel bad > about those limits. You are all such giving people, but like teachers, > you will never really know how many lives you've touched or how many > kids' interest in math, science, and astronomy you have kindled. > I agree with Chuck that universities should be looking to promote more > astronomy programs in high schools to feed their programs, but where do > you think the kids who take classes like mine come from? They come > families whose kids have attended your star parties and lectures, > whether as students at their schools, as boy scouts at camps, or > visitors to national parks. In response to my question, about > two-thirds of my 24 astronomy students have attended the kinds of > activities conducted by groups like SLAS or OAC. You are out there > doing great work, and I thank you for it. Keep it up, but don't try to > run faster than you are able. > Sorry this has run on so long, but now for my conclusion: just keep > doing what you are doing. The teachers who want star parties are, for > the most part getting them, and mostly for free, too! > > Sincerely, > Wayne A. Sumner > Math/Physics/Astronomy/Engineering > Boy's Tennis Coach > Northridge High School > Davis School District > (801) 402-8610 >>>> Chuck Hards <chuck.hards(a)gmail.com> 04/15/09 3:38 PM >>> > I keep thinking of the U of U astronomy professors have talked about SLAS > being a "feeder" of interested students into the program up there, when > they > should be looking to the area high-school science departments. A much, > much > bigger potential pool of candidates there. Obviously there is a disconnect > somewhere. I'm not blaming the teachers, it's probably systemic in nature. > > Echoing Rodger and Roger, SLAS seems to be where the > astronomically-inclined > spend their "golden" years, not their formative ones. > > Well, myself excluded, lol. > > Bruce, Patrick, Mark; all the club "elders" need to be mentoring their > eventual successors now. I'm doing this where I work. I hired a young kid > and have been taking him through an apprenticeship, with the goal of him > taking over for me when I retire. > _______________________________________________ > Utah-Astronomy mailing list > Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php > Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com > > _______________________________________________ > Utah-Astronomy mailing list > Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php > Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com > _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet West in 3D
by Jim Gibson 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

Chuck, The stars are not showing in the background. Oh well. You have to see this one on your big screen; The giant squid better known as the California Nebula. http://hwilson.zenfolio.com/p90112200/h16625a6f#h16625a6f Bright stars in front then nebula then background stars; sweet! For anyone that can't quite get their eyes crossed just right I found a technique that helps me. Hold your index finger up about 6 - 8 inches in front of your face between you and the image on the screen. The screen should be about 2 feet away or a little more. Focus on your index finger with the image right behind. Right above your finger you will see a 3rd image appear between the 2 images. Now if you can get your finger away and still keep your eyes crossed you will see the 3D image. Cool stuff. I can hardly wait to show my grandkids. Jim --- On Thu, 4/16/09, Chuck Hards <chuck.hards(a)gmail.com> wrote: From: Chuck Hards <chuck.hards(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet West in 3D To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, April 16, 2009, 9:19 AM Very well-done, Jim! I need to look at these at home on my big monitor later. If the stars are behind the comet, it's correct. If the stars appear to be in front of the comet, you need to change the images left-for-right. Using crossed eyes generally means the reverse orientation as that used with a stereoscope. _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Messin' with Patrick's pics
by Joe Bauman 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

Patrick's photos are so fine -- all I can say is, I wish I had seen Comet West. -- Joe --- On Wed, 4/15/09, Chuck Hards <chuck.hards(a)gmail.com> wrote: From: Chuck Hards <chuck.hards(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Messin' with Patrick's pics To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Wednesday, April 15, 2009, 11:16 PM Not too shabby, Joe. That sure brought back the memories of standing in the snow on Little Mountain back then. You can see the mountain near the head of the comet. Now in your mind's eye, imagine the tail stretching halfway to the zenith. _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet West in 3D
by Jim Gibson 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

Joe, I did a stereo of your 2 images. They are a bit small but it’s cool in 3D. Nice job Joe. http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=1782 Jim

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet West in 3D
by Jim Gibson 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

I got it! I got it! I had to sit back a little farther and then when I crossed my eyes I saw Patrick's Comet West in 3D. Very Nice Patrick! Jim --- On Thu, 4/16/09, Jim Gibson <jimgibson00(a)yahoo.com> wrote: From: Jim Gibson <jimgibson00(a)yahoo.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Comet West in 3D To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, April 16, 2009, 7:36 AM Chuck, I notice you mention stereo images on occasion. Time for a little tutelage here. I was admiring Joe’s work with Patrick’s Comet West images so I took 2 different original images and placed them side by side for stereo effect. http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=1777 I am having a hard time crossing my eyes to get the stereo effect with those images as compared with this image http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=1780 If I remember correctly you mentioned somewhere that the 2 images have to be off-set somehow; Patrick's are slightly different. With the bubble images when I cross my eyes I see a 3rd image in the middle and when I concentrate on it, it pops into 3d for me; looks cool. I can’t seem to do that with my rendition of Comet West. Thought you might be able to point out what I am missing. Jim _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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Comet West in 3D
by Jim Gibson 16 Apr '09

16 Apr '09

Chuck, I notice you mention stereo images on occasion. Time for a little tutelage here. I was admiring Joe’s work with Patrick’s Comet West images so I took 2 different original images and placed them side by side for stereo effect. http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=1777 I am having a hard time crossing my eyes to get the stereo effect with those images as compared with this image http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=1780 If I remember correctly you mentioned somewhere that the 2 images have to be off-set somehow; Patrick's are slightly different. With the bubble images when I cross my eyes I see a 3rd image in the middle and when I concentrate on it, it pops into 3d for me; looks cool. I can’t seem to do that with my rendition of Comet West. Thought you might be able to point out what I am missing. Jim

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Messin' with Patrick's pics
by Joe Bauman 15 Apr '09

15 Apr '09

OOPS, I meant his 1976 photos of Comet West. -- jb --- On Wed, 4/15/09, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman(a)yahoo.com> wrote: From: Joe Bauman <josephmbauman(a)yahoo.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Messin' with Patrick's pics To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Wednesday, April 15, 2009, 4:29 PM Just for fun, I tried using the relatively new technique of stacking Patrick's two magnificent 1975 views of Comet West. I *think* the sigma clip version provided a better composite, at least with less grain and possibly more detail in the comet's tails. The "sum" version seems too harsh to me, but may not be. I posted the two photos as Patrick put them on the SLAS Gallery, then the two that I made by combining his with different techniques. Anyway, let me know what you think: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=80 Thanks, Joe _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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Messin' with Patrick's pics
by Joe Bauman 15 Apr '09

15 Apr '09

Just for fun, I tried using the relatively new technique of stacking Patrick's two magnificent 1975 views of Comet West. I *think* the sigma clip version provided a better composite, at least with less grain and possibly more detail in the comet's tails. The "sum" version seems too harsh to me, but may not be. I posted the two photos as Patrick put them on the SLAS Gallery, then the two that I made by combining his with different techniques. Anyway, let me know what you think: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=80 Thanks, Joe

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] member loaner scope vs school subsidy
by Roger Butz 15 Apr '09

15 Apr '09

I have voiced numerous times at multiple SLAS venues from General and Board meetings to Advanced training that we need to try to include young kids in our club, it has always come to a dead end. I think our dependable core group is often overwhelmed with what we do already and any additional long term project that requires a size able effort to perform adequately is just too much to handle.There are a great many worthy endeavors we could involve ourselves in, and many have been enthusiastically proposed over the years, most dissolve in short order due to lack of support from or members.Not I think because of apathy but rather too many things to do and not enough manpower.We as individuals often have only so many hours we can dedicate to astronomy in a given month. I'm guilty of signing up to support proposed endeavors only to find that life steps in and requires me to re prioritize and withdraw from the event or project.Another problem I've seen personally more than once is when a kid gets inspired the parent often isn't inspired enough to sacrifice the time to chauffeur the kids to the events and hang about to chaperon. Being among some of the most active Astronomy clubs in the nation requires a lot of dedication as it is, we need to be certain that we have a sustainable support staff for any additional big endeavors. Initial enthusiasm and sustained support for are not the same thing as we've seen multiple times.Maybe we could get a committee of two or three of us to take a few months and take an in-depth look at other clubs successful efforts in having a sustainable youth group or outreach program within their clubs or similar projects directed at youth, and then try and focus in one direction and see how we do. I dint know, Ive always really felt we should be putting in a more focused effort towards the youth, But you know what, I don't have the time either, something else would have to give. A worthy cause any way.Roger --- On Wed, 4/15/09, erikhansen(a)TheBlueZone.net <erikhansen(a)TheBlueZone.net> wrote: From: erikhansen(a)TheBlueZone.net <erikhansen(a)TheBlueZone.net> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] member loaner scope vs school subsidy To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Wednesday, April 15, 2009, 12:51 PM >Perhaps, too much has been read into many of the posts. I am very interested in ideas from teachers that are on our list. My basic idea is with University launching their Astronomy Degree, I just wonder if we can aide the public school system in getting students interested in it. The problem will always be finding volunteers to take the time and effort. I should be discussed by the board, there has been good support for school star parties, but often demand out weighs supply. Some way of schools conducting their own astronomy activities seems needed. To me it seems a lot of our emphasis is on introducing kids to astronomy, I wonder if we could do more for kids that have a genuine interest. I think SLAS would benefit from this. It is beyond my understanding what the school system needs or is interested in, we will need input from educators. Erik I withdraw my post, way too much has been read into it, or more likely, > too > little of it was clearly understood, my mistake. I'm not a good > communicator. I just tossed out some ideas, never suggested pursuit of > any > particular strategy. I wondered why members who are teachers didn't seem > to > take advantage of the loaner scope program. As has been posted already, a > member who borrows a scope can take it wherever they want while in their > custody. Public relations is actually about the lowest priority on my > personal astronomy list, anyway. I'll happily show-off the sky and mentor > someone if they seek me out, but I will not go out of my my way to find > them. I leave that up to folks with time on their hands. > _______________________________________________ > Utah-Astronomy mailing list > Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php > Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com > _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com

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