July 2017 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement
by Dan Farrell 11 Jul '17

11 Jul '17

Hmm, high density polyurethane foam would also be easy to shape and work with. I could also use HDPE maybe. I have a chunk of 1inch laying around. Any other opinions about the applicability of these materials? Dan Farrell M17 #301 casioqv(a)usermail.com wrote: >This polyurethane bow eye wedge could be an option to replace the wood backing if damaged: > >https://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/1110/plastic-backing-block… > >Sincerely, >Tyler > >----- Original Message ----- >From: jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org >To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 8:01:46 AM >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement > >The wood backup is there for two reasons- to spread the load, and to give >the structure a bit of compressibility, which will keep tension on the >U-bolt and keep it from unwinding. > >I think there has been very little problem with it, in fact this is the >first time I've heard of a problem, but like all exterior hardware it should >be pulled off every few years and rebedded. > >-----Original Message----- >From: John Schinnerer >Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 6:03 AM >To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement > >My question would be, why was there a chunk of wood used there in the >first place? Rather than just bolting it to the fiberglass, maybe with >some kind of resin-based stiffener. > >If there was a good reason why the wood was used - flexibility? Shock >absorption? spreading the stress load? etc., I'd consider that when >repairing. > >If no functional reason - maybe it was just quicker and cheaper as a >spacer - then your idea might be fine. > >I think you mean fumed silica or amorphous silica though (the powdery >forms)...'colloidal' means a suspension in a liquid, which probably >wouldn't mix well with the epoxy... :-) > >cheers, >John S. > > >On 07/11/2017 03:48 PM, Dan Farrell wrote: >> I recently discovered that the wood used to reinforce the bow ring if my >> '79 m-17 had been ruined by water intrusion. The fiberglass over it's top >> had collapsed. >> >> I've removed the damaged fiberglass and the wood pulp, and was planning to >> glass over the area little by little from the bottom up, filling in the >> space formerly filled by wood with epoxy thickened with colloidal silica. >> >> Does this seem like a poor plan to anyone? >> >> Dan Farrell >> M17 #301 >> > >-- >John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >-------------------------------------------- >- Eco-Living - >Whole Systems Design Services >People - Place - Learning - Integration >john(a)eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 >http://eco-living.net >http://sociocracyconsulting.com >

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Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement
by Dan Farrell 11 Jul '17

11 Jul '17

Well, since you asked Jerry, I've been mooring the boat by this ring. It's a small lake ( very small, only 200 odd acres) and I haven't been using the clear because without chocks I worried about chafe on the mooring line from toe rail or the bow fitting. Perhaps that is part of the problem? I rebedded this in 2015 and likely did a poor job and allowed water intrusion. The off centered force from mooring the boat here might have exacerbated this. Still, I am surprised it was an issue since the bow ring shouldn't be seeing that much water ; it is pretty high up. Dan Farrell M17 #301 jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org wrote: >The wood backup is there for two reasons- to spread the load, and to give >the structure a bit of compressibility, which will keep tension on the >U-bolt and keep it from unwinding. > >I think there has been very little problem with it, in fact this is the >first time I've heard of a problem, but like all exterior hardware it should >be pulled off every few years and rebedded. > >-----Original Message----- >From: John Schinnerer >Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 6:03 AM >To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement > >My question would be, why was there a chunk of wood used there in the >first place? Rather than just bolting it to the fiberglass, maybe with >some kind of resin-based stiffener. > >If there was a good reason why the wood was used - flexibility? Shock >absorption? spreading the stress load? etc., I'd consider that when >repairing. > >If no functional reason - maybe it was just quicker and cheaper as a >spacer - then your idea might be fine. > >I think you mean fumed silica or amorphous silica though (the powdery >forms)...'colloidal' means a suspension in a liquid, which probably >wouldn't mix well with the epoxy... :-) > >cheers, >John S. > > >On 07/11/2017 03:48 PM, Dan Farrell wrote: >> I recently discovered that the wood used to reinforce the bow ring if my >> '79 m-17 had been ruined by water intrusion. The fiberglass over it's top >> had collapsed. >> >> I've removed the damaged fiberglass and the wood pulp, and was planning to >> glass over the area little by little from the bottom up, filling in the >> space formerly filled by wood with epoxy thickened with colloidal silica. >> >> Does this seem like a poor plan to anyone? >> >> Dan Farrell >> M17 #301 >> > >-- >John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >-------------------------------------------- >- Eco-Living - >Whole Systems Design Services >People - Place - Learning - Integration >john(a)eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 >http://eco-living.net >http://sociocracyconsulting.com > > >

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Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement
by thomaspbuzzi 11 Jul '17

11 Jul '17

on my 17 circa 1977 there was a wooden block glasses into the hull. I added a layer of glasses and refilled the 2 holes and used ss nylon locknuts on the 2 legs of the boweye. Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device -------- Original message --------From: John Schinnerer <john(a)eco-living.net> Date: 7/11/17 6:03 AM (GMT-08:00) To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement My question would be, why was there a chunk of wood used there in the first place? Rather than just bolting it to the fiberglass, maybe with some kind of resin-based stiffener. If there was a good reason why the wood was used - flexibility? Shock absorption? spreading the stress load? etc., I'd consider that when repairing. If no functional reason - maybe it was just quicker and cheaper as a spacer - then your idea might be fine. I think you mean fumed silica or amorphous silica though (the powdery forms)...'colloidal' means a suspension in a liquid, which probably wouldn't mix well with the epoxy... :-) cheers, John S. On 07/11/2017 03:48 PM, Dan Farrell wrote: > I recently discovered that the wood used to reinforce the bow ring if my '79 m-17 had been ruined by water intrusion. The fiberglass over it's top had collapsed. > > I've removed the damaged fiberglass and the wood pulp, and was planning to glass over the area little by little from the bottom up, filling in the space formerly filled by wood with epoxy thickened with colloidal silica. > > Does this seem like a poor plan to anyone? > > Dan Farrell > M17 #301 > -- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john(a)eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com

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Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement
by thomaspbuzzi 11 Jul '17

11 Jul '17

use nylon ss lock nuts Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device -------- Original message --------From: casioqv(a)usermail.com Date: 7/11/17 9:05 AM (GMT-08:00) To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement This polyurethane bow eye wedge could be an option to replace the wood backing if damaged: https://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/1110/plastic-backing-block… Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 8:01:46 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement The wood backup is there for two reasons- to spread the load, and to give the structure a bit of compressibility, which will keep tension on the U-bolt and keep it from unwinding. I think there has been very little problem with it, in fact this is the first time I've heard of a problem, but like all exterior hardware it should be pulled off every few years and rebedded. -----Original Message----- From: John Schinnerer Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2017 6:03 AM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement My question would be, why was there a chunk of wood used there in the first place? Rather than just bolting it to the fiberglass, maybe with some kind of resin-based stiffener. If there was a good reason why the wood was used - flexibility? Shock absorption? spreading the stress load? etc., I'd consider that when repairing. If no functional reason - maybe it was just quicker and cheaper as a spacer - then your idea might be fine. I think you mean fumed silica or amorphous silica though (the powdery forms)...'colloidal' means a suspension in a liquid, which probably wouldn't mix well with the epoxy... :-) cheers, John S. On 07/11/2017 03:48 PM, Dan Farrell wrote: > I recently discovered that the wood used to reinforce the bow ring if my > '79 m-17 had been ruined by water intrusion. The fiberglass over it's top > had collapsed. > > I've removed the damaged fiberglass and the wood pulp, and was planning to > glass over the area little by little from the bottom up, filling in the > space formerly filled by wood with epoxy thickened with colloidal silica. > > Does this seem like a poor plan to anyone? > > Dan Farrell > M17 #301 > -- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john(a)eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com

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Rebuilding bow ring reinforcement
by Dan Farrell 11 Jul '17

11 Jul '17

I recently discovered that the wood used to reinforce the bow ring if my '79 m-17 had been ruined by water intrusion. The fiberglass over it's top had collapsed. I've removed the damaged fiberglass and the wood pulp, and was planning to glass over the area little by little from the bottom up, filling in the space formerly filled by wood with epoxy thickened with colloidal silica. Does this seem like a poor plan to anyone? Dan Farrell M17 #301

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M17- How I repaired my leaky, rusty slug keel: Filled air pockets in keel with epoxy
by James Hymes 09 Jul '17

09 Jul '17

Hello all.. I bought hull 69 (not "Coyote" M17 Flush Deck #69 ) in July, 2011(don't know how there are two hulls with same number) When I bought the boat the centerboard was stuck in the keel. I used a hacksaw blade and worked it between the CB and keel and removed most likely some gelcoat ( was it gelcoat or fiberglass in the slot of the keel). After sailing a few times, I noticed water dripping out of a couple holes at the front of the keel of my M17 (the holes possibly caused from impacts). I drilled a couple holes along the bottom of the keel and water poured out of the keel in a stream. There was standing water in the cabin underneath the sole which had deteriorated the gelcoat just aft of the CB trunk. Not sure if this was related to the water entering the keel. Did the following repair: Drilled 1/4" or 3/8" holes all around the keel exterior starboard and port, and injected a mixture of epoxy resin and filler starting at the bottom of the keel. Injected into lowest drilled hole until the epoxy started oozing out of a nearby hole. When it started oozing out of the nearby hole, I plugged the hole I was injecting into with wood dowel, then injected into the next hole. Working from the bottom up, my goal was to eliminate air pockets around the steel slugs, thus hopefully preventing air, water and steel to cause rust (expansion of steel slugs). I worked my way up the keel. At a certain height I drilled through the keel wall and encountered foam such as the foam found in seat cushions. I stopped at that point, since the steel slugs wouldn't occupy the same space as that (soggy) foam. I also removed the rusty cast iron centerboard, had it sandblasted and refaired and painted it. I can't recall if the CB dropped after reinstalling it into the keel or if when I sailed with the board up and ran aground into a sandbar and filled the space between the CB and keel with sand causing it to be stuck...Need to get the hacksaw blade out again maybe. Actually haven't sailed in a couple years due to the rotator cuff injury caused by lifting rudder over transom by myself (I'm a small guy). Finally just had the shoulder surgery, anxious to sail again in a couple moths hopefully...May need to hoist boat and remove centerboard to solve that problem, maybe drill more holes in keel to check for water.... Anyways, anyone got an opinion as to my epoxy fill repair to the keel?? Happy sailing, Jim

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Re: M_Boats: Selling my Montgomery 17
by bownez＠juno.com 09 Jul '17

09 Jul '17

Gilbert, 15 years of absolute fun for $3500. Now that is something to be proud of and brag about! Handsomely done. Mr. Bones ____________________________________________________________ Police Urge Americans to Carry This With Them at All Times The Observer http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/59621d34e3bad1d344638st04vuc

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Re: M_Boats: Selling my Montgomery 17
by bownez＠juno.com 08 Jul '17

08 Jul '17

That is a fabulous price Gilbert! Sorry to see you need to sell. Mr. Bones ____________________________________________________________ 1 Simple Trick Removes Eye Bags & Lip Lines In Seconds Fit Mom Daily http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/5960d024bc45b502434e4st02vuc

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Selling my Montgomery 17
by Gilbert Landin 08 Jul '17

08 Jul '17

In corpus christi, Texas asking 3500.00 decent trailer, galvanized and customized for the monty. 1000.00 value CDI roller furler with tan bark sails in very good condition, still have original sails including spinnaker. The boat has not been in the water since I sanded and barrier coated and freshly painted with petite hydrocoat antifoul. Steel centerboard has not been replaced, just been lazy but thats the only thing keeping it out of the water. [image: Inline image 1] -- Gilbert Landin cell 774-7106

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Re: M_Boats: Gaff Rig M-15
by Jazzy 07 Jul '17

07 Jul '17

Hi Doug, just wanted to pass on that I live 8 min from the Gig Harbor boat guys if you need anything. I see their boats in the harbor and all of them are salty and look exceptionally well made sliding through the water. Those guys are in the shop sanding by hand all day! It's a small operation churning out boats slowly by hand. I pop in every now and then to have a looksie and they're always friendly and welcoming. -Jazz On Mar 26, 2017 2:48 PM, "Douglas Kelch" <doug1kelch(a)gmail.com> wrote: Hi Sal, Planning on moving out of the hot Phoenix area in a couple of years. So I sold my kayaks, sold the Sandpiper 565. I will keep my 8 ft Sherpa, balance lug rig, for rowing exercise and some beach cruising. If I get another boat my current thoughts are towards a good rowing sailboat with beach cruising capability (light weight to haul up on the beach), and minimal time to launch. Candidates are Gig harbor boats 15 ft Maine lobster boat, John Welsford Walkabout,and B&B boat works 15 ft Bay River Skiff. I am in no hurry so will not take any action for at least a year or so. Wooden epoxy boats do not fare well in the direct sun of the desert so good storage would be an issue until I move. By the way Sal, You had recommended a personal improvement book last year and I lost the name. If you remember it could you send it along? Thanks Doug On Sat, Mar 25, 2017 at 9:02 PM, sal glesser via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> wrote: > It's a great boat! > > Hey Doug, let us know what your plans are? > > salngail >

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