May 2013 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Sailing with a new friend
by Daniel Rich 12 May '13

12 May '13

Today I went sailing with Thom Loftus. He found me on this list. He is interested in an M15 or M17. He got to sail the M15 today with me. Here is a blog post with video about the day for anybody interested. Daniel's Blog Daniel Rich M15 #208 "Kestrel" danielgrich(a)gmail.com

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Re: M_Boats: Bottom Paint On Montgomery 15 - centerboard picture
by W David Scobie 12 May '13

12 May '13

looks like the centerboard picture didn't attach ... now for a second attempt. :: Dave Scobie --- On Thu, 5/9/13, W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > Scott: > ... > as already discussed the pin goes through the > centerboard. i've attached a picture that shows the > 'parts' of an M15, M17, M23 and S17 centerboard (all have > the same essential design just differing sizes based on year > of build). > > > :: Dave Scobie > > --- On Wed, 5/8/13, Scott Larson <salarson2(a)comcast.net> > wrote: > > > I am in the process of getting > > my newly acquired Montgomery 15 ready for > > bottom paint. Since it will be sitting at a mooring, > I > > think it will be > > prudent to prep it with an epoxy barrier paint and > then > > paint with my bottom > > paint of choice. I have found a product that seems > to > > get the hull nice and > > clean. It is this highly caustic stuff, but tends to > > get all the grub and > > stains off the hull. I will be using a new product > by > > West Marine (made by > > Petit). They claim you should prepare the hull using > > this stuff that costs > > over 30.00 a quart to remove residual mold release > > agent. I suppose it is > > possible that there may still be some mold release > agent on > > a 30 YO hull. > > But even if there is, I have read that it can be > > removed with warm water > > and a sponge. Does anyone have any feedback on this > > matter? > > > > As for painting the bottom with barrier coat, is there > any > > reason why I > > cannot just paint over the small scratches with the > barrier > > coat without > > filling them? Also, there are some areas with small > > blisters, about 1-2 mm. > > What should I do with those? > > > > Also, a few of the scratches seem to reveal green > gelcoat > > beneath the white > > gelcoat. Is it possible that the boat was originally > > given a coat of green > > gelcoat beneath the white gelcoat? This might > actually > > make sense if the > > entire mold were sprayed with white up to the > sheerstrake > > first, then had > > the entire inside of the mold sprayed up to the > sheerline > > with green gelcoat > > to get the green stripe. The other possibility is > that > > the hull was > > originally green and it was painted or given a new > gelcoat > > up to the > > sheerstrake. If that were the case, whoever did it, > > did a pretty good job > > of it. > > > > As for the centerboard, the pin is covered with what > appears > > to be a > > silicone marine sealant on each side. Should I just > > leave that alone and > > hope for the best? Does the centerboard have a hook > at > > the end where it > > attaches to the pin? In that case held in by the > force > > of gravity? From > > the pictures of John Harris' repair, it appears that > he > > re-set the pin > > before putting the board back in. > > > > Any insight would be great! > > > > Scott Larson > > > > > >

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Rudder Craft rudder, two or three pintles.
by IdaSailor Marine 11 May '13

11 May '13

Hi, Just to be clear, the rudder craft rudders come with either two or three pintle set-ups, as your boat requires. We also build them with either size pintle on the lowest pintle, either 1/2" or 3/8" depending on how your Montgomery is equipped. We've built more than two hundred of these assemblies in various configurations, and we build them to fit an owner's particular boat exactly. We do not keep them on the shelf in any given configuration, but build them as they are ordered, to ensure a perfect fit. Thanks, -Joel -- Joel Santarone General Manager Rudder Craft www.ruddercraft.com 866-400-2204 toll free

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cover for M15
by Daniel Rich 11 May '13

11 May '13

Montypals: I want a nice cover for my M15. So, I emailed the Sailor's Tailor, but they don't have a pattern for the M15. They would need to have the boat. Not possible, since they are in Ohio, and I am in California! (Well, I know Dan Phy could do it, but that is another story...) So, where can I go in the SF Bay Area to get a nice cover? I am tired of the $50 tarp I use. Daniel M15 Kestrel

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Re: M_Boats: cover for M15
by SALGLESSER＠aol.com 11 May '13

11 May '13

Hi Daniel, When Momma aint happy, aint nobody happy! sal In a message dated 5/11/2013 8:56:26 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time, danielgrich(a)gmail.com writes: I am doing the same thing. Fits well, cheap, covers the whole boat, really easy to take on and off. But my wife thinks it is ugly! That is the problem. Since the boat sits in the driveway next to the house, I get grief over that. Daniel On May 10, 2013, at 7:46 PM, David Grah <d_b_grah(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > I liked the cover in Dave Scobie's photos but have to admit I am very happy with my $35 tarp and would probably take it over the cover in the photos. It fits pretty well, stays on in high winds, and covers most of the hull. Almost as good as a garage, if you ask me. Hopefully I have successfully attached a photo of it. > > David Grah > Bishop California > > > Date: Fri, 10 May 2013 13:58:42 -0700 > From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: cover for M15 > Message-ID: <518D5F82.90907(a)gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Montypals: > > I want a nice cover for my M15. So, I emailed the Sailor's Tailor, but > they don't have a pattern for the M15. They would need to have the boat. > Not possible, since they are in Ohio, and I am in California! (Well, I > know Dan Phy could do it, but that is another story...) > > So, where can I go in the SF Bay Area to get a nice cover? I am tired of > the $50 tarp I use. > > Daniel > M15 Kestrel<DSC01556.JPG>

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Bottom Paint On Montgomery 15
by Scott Larson 10 May '13

10 May '13

I am in the process of getting my newly acquired Montgomery 15 ready for bottom paint. Since it will be sitting at a mooring, I think it will be prudent to prep it with an epoxy barrier paint and then paint with my bottom paint of choice. I have found a product that seems to get the hull nice and clean. It is this highly caustic stuff, but tends to get all the grub and stains off the hull. I will be using a new product by West Marine (made by Petit). They claim you should prepare the hull using this stuff that costs over 30.00 a quart to remove residual mold release agent. I suppose it is possible that there may still be some mold release agent on a 30 YO hull. But even if there is, I have read that it can be removed with warm water and a sponge. Does anyone have any feedback on this matter? As for painting the bottom with barrier coat, is there any reason why I cannot just paint over the small scratches with the barrier coat without filling them? Also, there are some areas with small blisters, about 1-2 mm. What should I do with those? Also, a few of the scratches seem to reveal green gelcoat beneath the white gelcoat. Is it possible that the boat was originally given a coat of green gelcoat beneath the white gelcoat? This might actually make sense if the entire mold were sprayed with white up to the sheerstrake first, then had the entire inside of the mold sprayed up to the sheerline with green gelcoat to get the green stripe. The other possibility is that the hull was originally green and it was painted or given a new gelcoat up to the sheerstrake. If that were the case, whoever did it, did a pretty good job of it. As for the centerboard, the pin is covered with what appears to be a silicone marine sealant on each side. Should I just leave that alone and hope for the best? Does the centerboard have a hook at the end where it attaches to the pin? In that case held in by the force of gravity? From the pictures of John Harris' repair, it appears that he re-set the pin before putting the board back in. Any insight would be great! Scott Larson

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Cleaning the carburetor of a Honda 2hp
by Daniel Rich 09 May '13

09 May '13

Montypals: Well, got the outboard out today to see how she was doing. Won't start. I left the gas in all winter with some Sta-bil. Probably not a wise choice. I don't know much about these engines. In any event, I suspect I need to pull the carburetor out and take it apart and clean it with carb cleaner etc. Anybody got a schematic or instructions on how to do this? I can't seem to find a manual about it. Daniel M15 Kestrel #208

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Bottom Paint On Montgomery 15
by Scott Larson 09 May '13

09 May '13

Dave, I was not able to see the picture. Am I viewing the messages on the wrong page (The archive)? How does one respond to a thread? I did this by copying the subject line and putting it in a new email, we will see if it works. I took another look at these small blisters today. They look like a very mild case of eczema. In fact they are only really noticeable by feeling the hull or by sighting down the length of the strake with the right light at the other end. I poked at one with a utility knife, with a little effort, I was able to chip a piece of the gel coat off the location that appeared to be a small potential blister. There was no water inside, but the boat has not been in the water for a few years, and the blister in question is too small to have any detectable amount of water in it anyway. They are all that size or smaller. And they probably do not even cover more than about a square foot or two of the hull (including all the space between them). I am about ready to start sanding to scruff up the surface, but first I need to find a new disk for my Ridgid 6" sander. It appears that the Velcro tends to go bad on them, and Home Depot is even aware of this problem. But they do not stock a replacement part, bummer. Scott Larson

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Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 123, Issue 4
by Steve Varley 09 May '13

09 May '13

Sorry. This is a link to The Montgomery Group on the web. You use this link on your computer to get to a link where you can join. I highly recommend it as it's an interesting bunch and can answer any question you may have about Montgomery boats. Most people have 15's and 17's. The page I sent you had a discussion of what car/truck people are using to tow their M 15 with. http://msog.org/listserv.cfm On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 11:49 AM, < montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com> wrote: > Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: pickup for towing (Daniel Rich) > 2. Re: pickup for towing (Daniel Rich) > 3. Re: pickup for towing (GILASAILR(a)aol.com) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 08 May 2013 10:22:14 -0700 > From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: M_Boats: pickup for towing > Message-ID: <518A89C6.3060706(a)gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > This is good information. My Honda Accord has 240 HP and has no trouble > towing. But, the problem as I see it is the braking. It is not designed > for this, and I am concerned with regards to safety. So, it looks like a > V6 Ford Ranger would do well. Lots of them on the used market at > reasonable prices. > > Daniel > On 5/8/2013 9:40 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > >> ... a base model Ranger or Tacoma with the small engine? > >> Aren't they still rated higher for towing? > > the 'base' ranger with the small 4-cylinder engine looks like a truck > ... but it is really underpowered. > > > > i don't know specifics for the much older trucks. my 2005 ranger owners > manual says that the 2.3L 4-cyclinder ranger 2-wheel drive, standard cab > with a 6' bed can handle a trailer 1600 lbs. now the BUT the GCWR is 4800. > 7' bed trailer weight 1520 lbs, GCWR 4800. extended 'super' cab with 6' > bed 1420 lbs and GCWR 4800. > > > > go to an automatic and gain an extra 600 lbs of towing capacity and 700 > lbs GCWR. > > > > the 'dry' curb weight for the standard ranger is 3050 lbs (no > passengers, no gas, no cooler of beer). my bet, as the listed weight is > 'stripped' truck, is the real curb weight is around 3500 lbs and then add > your weight + your stuff. > > > > after showing the numbers i'll say way i said 'no' to the 'little > engined' ranger - > > > > the 2.3L is REALLY REALLY underpowered. when i worked for Univ. of > Minnesota in the mid-90s the department truck was a late 80s standard > ranger with the little engine. OK for driving around town ... but it had > difficulty keeping highway speed when going into a headwind or climbing the > small Minnesota hills. yes a newer ranger will have more horsepower ... > but not that much more. > > > > i owned a 3.0L ranger for 11 years. the 3.0L also also had difficulty > going into a Minnesota headwind and wasn't the best climber (it was a slow > drive up the Cascades, Olympics and Rockies when i moved to Washington and > spent many a weekend and week camping and driving in these mountains). i > towed some utility trailers with this truck and it was a slug when you > attempted to get up to highway speeds and even slower when climbing hills. > > > > based on the above you will be at the max weight for a 2.3L ranger. i > don't recommend towing at the max weight for a vehicle. hard on the > vehicle's parts and hard on you as the vehicle is at the max and you will > be working harder to control the load (braking, climbing hills, going down > hills, turns, etc). > > > > ultimately the choice is yours ... just my 2-cents and comments from the > peanut gallery :-) > > > > have no idea on the 'toyo' small truck. last time i drove one was back > in the the 80s (a friend's, not my truck). > > > > good hunting Daniel. > > > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > > > > > --- On Wed, 5/8/13, Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> I have been able to tow my M15 with > >> my Honda Accord. But, the Accord is > >> only rated to 1000 pounds. It tows the boat with ease, but > >> as I say, my > >> boat and trailer weigh 1600 pounds. So, it seems to me > >> getting something > >> rated higher would make some sense, especially since with > >> the Leaf I > >> don't need another sedan. So a small truck seems like a good > >> idea. What > >> about a base model Ranger or Tacoma with the small engine? > >> Aren't they > >> still rated higher for towing? > >> > >> Daniel > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 08 May 2013 10:24:03 -0700 > From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: M_Boats: pickup for towing > Message-ID: <518A8A33.4030005(a)gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Nice, thanks! > > Daniel > On 5/8/2013 10:04 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > > Steve: > > > > i do like my 4L V6. lots of HP and in the last two years towed boats > about 45,000 from coast to coast. all of this is with a small camper on > the truck. > > > > i've attached a picture showing my setup. i no longer own the M15 > pictured (photo from June '08). for 'current' status just imagine a M17 or > Sage 17 behind the truck. > > > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > > > --- On Wed, 5/8/13, stevetrapp <stevetrapp(a)q.com> wrote: > > > >> Dave, > >> Get the V-6, not the smaller 4 cylinder. > >> The folks who compiled the specs or wrote the advertising > >> brochures have probably never tried to tow a boat over a > >> hill or on a highway. > >> Steve > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "W David Scobie" <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> > >> Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 9:40 AM > >> > >> > >>>> ... a base model Ranger or Tacoma with the small > >> engine? > >>>> Aren't they still rated higher for towing? > >>> the 'base' ranger with the small 4-cylinder engine > >> looks like a truck ... but it is really underpowered. > >>> i don't know specifics for the much older trucks. > >> my 2005 ranger owners manual says that the 2.3L 4-cyclinder > >> ranger 2-wheel drive, standard cab with a 6' bed can handle > >> a trailer 1600 lbs. now the BUT the GCWR is > >> 4800. 7' bed trailer weight 1520 lbs, GCWR 4800. > >> extended 'super' cab with 6' bed 1420 lbs and GCWR 4800. > >>> go to an automatic and gain an extra 600 lbs of towing > >> capacity and 700 lbs GCWR. > >>> the 'dry' curb weight for the standard ranger is 3050 > >> lbs (no passengers, no gas, no cooler of beer). my > >> bet, as the listed weight is 'stripped' truck, is the real > >> curb weight is around 3500 lbs and then add your weight + > >> your stuff. > >>> after showing the numbers i'll say way i said 'no' to > >> the 'little engined' ranger - > >>> the 2.3L is REALLY REALLY underpowered. when i > >> worked for Univ. of Minnesota in the mid-90s the department > >> truck was a late 80s standard ranger with the little > >> engine. OK for driving around town ... but it had > >> difficulty keeping highway speed when going into a headwind > >> or climbing the small Minnesota hills. yes a newer > >> ranger will have more horsepower ... but not that much > >> more. > >>> i owned a 3.0L ranger for 11 years. the 3.0L also > >> also had difficulty going into a Minnesota headwind and > >> wasn't the best climber (it was a slow drive up the > >> Cascades, Olympics and Rockies when i moved to Washington > >> and spent many a weekend and week camping and driving in > >> these mountains). i towed some utility trailers with > >> this truck and it was a slug when you attempted to get up to > >> highway speeds and even slower when climbing hills. > >>> based on the above you will be at the max weight for a > >> 2.3L ranger. i don't recommend towing at the max > >> weight for a vehicle. hard on the vehicle's parts and > >> hard on you as the vehicle is at the max and you will be > >> working harder to control the load (braking, climbing hills, > >> going down hills, turns, etc). > >>> ultimately the choice is yours ... just my 2-cents and > >> comments from the peanut gallery :-) > >>> have no idea on the 'toyo' small truck. last time > >> i drove one was back in the the 80s (a friend's, not my > >> truck). > >>> good hunting Daniel. > >>> > >>> > >>> :: Dave Scobie > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 8 May 2013 14:45:21 -0400 (EDT) > From: GILASAILR(a)aol.com > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: M_Boats: pickup for towing > Message-ID: <e442f.35cc846d.3ebbf741(a)aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > Have towed M-17 with 3.4 V6 Toyota 4Runner 5speed (towed MUCH heavier > loads) and currently tow M-17 with 3.4 Tacoma dbl cab - auto - works > great. > > Don't dis the 4 bangers.- ( the Toyota 4 (22R) was used in a 1 ton > chassis (dually) and was available as a chassis mounted 22 foot motorhome > - over > 28 manufacturers!!) see photo for example.- 4 bangers can be quite capable > if properly equipped. Braking is always the determining factor - My > opinion - but golly - I used to drive a 62 VW bus either towing a C-15 or > with my > M-10 on a roof rack -just in case - 'slow' doesn't bother me. 40hp in 1 > ton truck. > > Plenty of Rangers available - good trucks (hold their value well too) and > they are now collectible as Ford does not offer them in US anymore! > > Your mileage may very vary- remember ALWAYS wear eye protection............ > and write home - they are wondering what's happening. > > GO > > > In a message dated 5/8/2013 9:31:36 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, > stevetrapp(a)q.com writes: > > Rich, > I recommend a lighter truck, such as a Ford Ranger or Toyota of the > comparable model with a V-6 for towing the M-15. I have attempted to tow > my M-15 > with lighter vehicles with 4 cylinders, and also found that although > dealers are more than happy to sell towing packages, the lighter > vechicles with > smaller engines just don't have enough muscle to feel comfortable on > highways or hills. My towing involves hills and Interstates, and my > Ranger with > the V-6 does fine. I think a bigger truck would be more than I need. > Steve > M-15 # 335 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Daniel Rich" <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> > To: <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 8:44 AM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: pickup for towing > > > >I have been able to tow my M15 with my Honda Accord. But, the Accord is > > only rated to 1000 pounds. It tows the boat with ease, but as I say, my > > boat and trailer weigh 1600 pounds. So, it seems to me getting something > > > rated higher would make some sense, especially since with the Leaf I > > don't need another sedan. So a small truck seems like a good idea. What > > about a base model Ranger or Tacoma with the small engine? Aren't they > > still rated higher for towing? > > > > Daniel > > On 5/7/2013 7:42 PM, George Iemmolo wrote: > >> Daniel > >> > >> I towed my just purchased M15 from Pittsburg, PA to Valparaiso, IN last > >> month with my 2006 Volvo S60 no problem > >> > >> George > >> Merry Helen II > >> #602 > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com > >> [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of > Conbert > >> Benneck > >> Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2013 5:30 PM > >> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > >> Subject: Re: M_Boats: pickup for towing > >> > >> On 07-May-13 4:28 PM, Daniel Rich wrote: > >> > >> Hi Daniel, > >> > >> I towed my M15 from Florida, where I bought it, to Connecticut, and > then > >> all over the place - Lake Champlain, Moosehead Lake, ME, the > >> Chesapeake,, Florida, using originally a VW-GTI and later a VW-Jetta > >> wagon with a VR6 engine and automatic transmission. > >> > >> I never had a problem; towing; launching or retrieving the M15. > >> > >> Connie > >> > >> M15 #400 LEPPO > >>> Montypals: > >>> > >>> Gonna pick up a Nissan Leaf EV in a few weeks. As such, I am going to > >>> likely sell my Honda Accord. So, I'm thinking it might be nice to have > >>> a small pickup truck to tow my M15. Weight of boat and trailer is 1600 > >>> pounds. I know because I weighed it twice since I couldn't believe it > >>> the first time! > >>> > >>> So, what would be a good used pickup that would have the capacity to > >>> tow this package? Would a used base Tacoma do it? Any thoughts here? > >>> > >>> Daniel > >>> M15 Kestrel > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > ----- > > No virus found in this message. > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > > Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3162/6308 - Release Date: > 05/08/13 > > >

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M23 port side leaks
by Theo Petron 09 May '13

09 May '13

Noticing that with a spring line yanking on my toe rail and a job sheet block tugging while I'm sailing rail-in-the-water, it must stress the toe rail such that it pulls away from the hull ever so slightly over time. This could be the cause of 1 of 3 leaks. Looks like rain, I'm off with some food coloring to find the others. Theo 1979 M23 Sails Increase Chef Theo Petron A la Maison Personal Chef Service Sent from my iPad

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