March 2012 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

attention: Doug Kelch
by Flickasf 26 Mar '12

26 Mar '12

I just read an old post that you decided to change your rig on your M 15 after sailing Dick's sun cat. This peaked my interest because I am now the owner of sun cat #16, just a few hull number before Dick's. I was at Havasau in 2011 and 2010 with my 15, Zephyr, and we met in 2011 while eating breakfast. I had not met Dick at the time. Since then he's helped me with my rigging questions as well as giving me an old sail which was much better than the one that came with the cat. I sold my M 15, and have my Flicka for sale because I had spinal fusion and wanted to avoid future problems if possible. It's a small world. Fair winds, Bert Felton flickasf(a)aol.com

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Re: M_Boats: horse is already out ...
by W David Scobie 26 Mar '12

26 Mar '12

> I feel already that GOOGLE and other search engines > that are already tied to YouTube and Facebook data > mine too much information. GOOGLE and Facebook and YouTube DO mine information. an example is GOOGLE and Youtube and Facebook asking your for your phone number as 'security' in case you loose your password. nope, this is how these companies make money. remember, there is no free lunch and if you see a 'free' service there IS a catch. > I get these POP UPs, if you get these you likely have a virus. all current browsers have blocking abilities (unless you don't have them activated). i see no popups in my browsing and have my computers set so 'tight' that the places the do need a popup to do something i want must ask for a site & time specific approval from me to show the page/data. > the horse is already out of the barn. the only way to have zero spam is to have no www-presence ... as in you you are never on the www from your own home, don't have facebook nor youtube accounts, and have NO email (etc). my home phone and cell phone are 'unlisted'. i still get 'spam' phone calls because robo dialers just 'call' every number in a sequence. 'robo' emailers do the same thing and just send out email to all available address combinations. :: Dave Scobie :: Sage Marine --- On Mon, 3/26/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: > > Bob, I understand your concern, but > our email addresses are already available all over the > net. Yours appears on your web site, > trailersailer.com, and lots of other locations as shown by a > quick google search. As the saying goes, the horse is > already out of the barn. > > In your mail program setup, you are asked for a name and an > email address. The information is displayed in mail headers > as > "name" <email(a)address.xxx>. > For example, From: "Keith Diehl" <kdiehl(a)xmission.com>, > or > From: "Bob Eeg" <montgomeryboats(a)hotmail.com>. > It appears that the Lurker search program only displays the > email name and not the address, but I'm not going to say > that email addresses might not be exposed now or in the > future. It's the internet! > > > Keith Diehl > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Eeg" <montgomeryboats(a)hotmail.com> > <<<---------- JUST LIKE THIS > To: <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Monday, March 26, 2012 11:12 AM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Vote Count - Searchable Archives > > > > Keith....my concern is a computer-bot program that will be > data mining all of our email addresses and other > information. > > Is there anyway you could put a human required firewall > question up front so a rogue program would be stopped before > entering? > Much like tinypic.com does before you download a photo. They > give you a script to type into a box to make sure you're not > a machine that > is data mining. If you can't protect our email addresses > from this, I would ask that you remove my information that > has my email addresses attached. > > What is so hard about requiring a simple sign up (a bot > program could not sign up) before accessing information? > > I feel already that GOOGLE and other search engines that are > already tied to YouTube and Facebook data mine too much > information. I get these POP UPs, web ads and rogue emails > constantly. > > Anyway to protect our email addresses Keith? > > Thanks > Bob > > > > > From: kdiehl(a)xmission.com > > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > > Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 10:31:32 -0600 > > Subject: M_Boats: Vote Count - Searchable Archives > > > > I've got 17.5 votes for open archives and 1.5 votes > against. > > > > Anyone else want to weigh in before I decide to opent > the archives and > > enable the search engine? > > > > Keith Diehl > > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Diehl" <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> > > To: "Montgomery Boats List" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > > Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 1:52 PM > > Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives > > > > > > > In the past, some members were very concerned that > their postings were > > > readable by non-members, so I closed the archives > to public viewing and > > > cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite > understood the concern, > > > since anyone can join the mailing and then read > everything old and new, > > > but > > > that was what was wanted. > > > > > > The question of searchable archives has come up > again, so I'll ask the > > > membership: > > > > > > Would you like to have searchable archives if it > means the archives are > > > readable by anyone on the internet, including > search engines? > > > > > > As an example of what we could have, here is the > main Lurker search > engine > > > page for Xmission hosted public lists; > > > > > > http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > > > > > > Keith Diehl > > > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > > > > > > > > > > = > >

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Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 109, Issue 19
by Randy 26 Mar '12

26 Mar '12

Hi All, I am in favor of a searchable archives and will gladly pay a fee to be able to do so. I try to save posts that I think I will need in the future but by the time a project comes to the surface, I have lost the post in a mass of unsorted email or worse yet deleted it to make room for more! Thanks to all who have contributed to posts on all things Montgomery! All the Best, Randy Wirth M-17 Fore Play -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2012 4:44 PM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 109, Issue 19 Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com You can reach the person managing the list at montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Searchable Archives (W David Scobie) 2. Re: The Border Run videos (Robbin Roddewig) 3. Re: Searchable Archives (August Trometer) 4. Re: Searchable Archives (Louis Remmers) 5. Re: Searchable Archives (Jeffrey Johnston) 6. Re: Searchable Archives (Chris Smith) 7. Re: Searchable Archives (Tom Jenkins) 8. Re: Searchable Archives (Daniel Rich) 9. Re: Searchable Archives (GILASAILR(a)aol.com) 10. Re: Bottom paint (Tom Smith) 11. Re: Searchable Archives (Michael Murphy) 12. Re: Bottom paint (jerry montgomery) 13. Re: Searchable Archives (Bill Wickett) 14. Re: Bottom paint (Tom Smith) 15. Re: Searchable Archives (Bill Day) 16. Re: Searchable Archives (Ed) 17. Fenders (Jeffrey Johnston) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 13:05:37 -0700 (PDT) From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <1332533137.22891.YahooMailClassic(a)web162704.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 keith: yes we need to have things searchable. there are lots of good information that needs to be accessible. without that information available one looses the 15+ years of history that is available on the list. what needs to be remembered that anything, ANYTHING, you do on the net is public (yes, this includes email and the www-sites you visit) and can be found/searched/read. :: Dave Scobie :: Sage Marine --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: > > In the past, some members were very > concerned that their postings were > readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing > and cancelled our searchable archives.? I never quite understood the > concern, since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything > old and new, but that was what was wanted. > > The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > membership: > > Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives > are readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > > As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search > engine page for Xmission hosted public lists; > > http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > > Keith Diehl > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 16:06:16 -0400 From: Robbin Roddewig <robbin.roddewig(a)verizon.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: The Border Run videos Message-ID: <4F6CD7B8.6070804(a)verizon.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Fabulous Sean! This made me smile! Can't wait to get back in the water after a few repairs are done! Cheers Robbin On 3/23/2012 1:13 PM, Nebwest2(a)aol.com wrote: > Thanks Tom.....It's been my great pleasure to be involved with this > community. I've said it so many times before....but this group of > folks can change your life. It certainly has mine. :-) Montgomery's are fabulous boats. > In my mind, I have sailed on NOTHING that compares. The feeling of > confidence I have when sailing the 17's I've owned (or the 23) is > amazing....and I have put them to the test a time or two over the > years. In my mind....feeble as it is....there are not many other boat > owners out there that can enjoy the piece of mind I do when sailing a > Montgomery. If you allow it to....it will take you to places you can > barely imagine....and if it gets crappy....she'll get you home. Not > only that...but once you learn to work with her and trust her, she'll get you home with a smile on your face, while others > are watching drop jawed. I honestly don't think that a lot of sailors, > sailing others brands of similarly sized boats understand this. you > truly have to experience it for it to set in. I find myself feeling > a bit sorry for the guy who is worried that if he pushes his boat too > far "She's going over" and so he's always got that in the back of his mind....wondering if he's > "getting close". Once you've experienced it...it's hard to consider > something else. Of course....that's all in my neophyte opinion! LOL > > Another great thing about the Montgomery line is that it cures 2 foot > itis! I used to be all about stepping up. Then I realized....I still > have some work to do to develop my skills and ability up to the ability of the boat I > already own.....and I OWN it ...no payments. And I can drag it anywhere I > have the gas money and desire to drag it! And suddenly....I am able > to cruise anywhere I want to cruise. It just doesn't get any better. > > And the last thing is... there are options to include everyone. If a > new one is what floats your boat, they are available...go for it. But > for the individuals that are not financially able to swing that > ...there are incredible deals on used ones that make "living the > dream" attainable to virtually anyone. You just can't beat that. > Everyone has the ability to join in and acquire a boat that will > safely take you where you want to go. Amazing when you think about > it. Larry and I just raced in a race where some of the boats were in > the multi -millions of dollars category...yet we were there, experiencing it in our 30+ year old Monty. Pretty darn cool!! > > yeah....this is a cool place to hang out! :-) > > Sail on!!!! > > ;-) > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 16:14:58 -0400 From: "August Trometer" <atrometer(a)gmail.com> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <000b01cd0931$9ff6c6d0$dfe45470$@com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Anyone - It will help keep the value UP -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Keith Diehl Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:53 PM To: Montgomery Boats List Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the concern, since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, but that was what was wanted. The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the membership: Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine page for Xmission hosted public lists; http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html Keith Diehl Cottonwood Heights, UT ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 13:26:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Louis Remmers <louremmers(a)yahoo.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <1332534377.40568.YahooMailClassic(a)web161004.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I think it is silly for anyone to " guard" the archives!? It was a GREAT pleasure to look at all th activities of the Montgomery fleet and it was a major reason to purchase one!? It should be avaliabve to anyone and in turn would prompt others to join the crew and purchase a Monty.? Is it better to not allow someone to see what a magnificent boat we all enjoy or invite them to join us!????? --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: From: Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives To: "Montgomery Boats List" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Friday, March 23, 2012, 2:52 PM In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and cancelled our searchable archives.? I never quite understood the concern, since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, but that was what was wanted. The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the membership: Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine page for Xmission hosted public lists; http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html Keith Diehl Cottonwood Heights, UT ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 15:29:52 -0500 From: Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <CAFS5qAssrAOWZC8dsu-e94HhZznLOFNoo0Wpkco5912wU-6MVg(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Amen to searchable and open to anyone. What in hell could be so top secret that we wouldn't want the archives? Jeff Johnston On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:14 PM, August Trometer <atrometer(a)gmail.com>wrote: > Anyone - It will help keep the value UP > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com > [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of > Keith Diehl > Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:53 PM > To: Montgomery Boats List > Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives > > In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were > readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing > and cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the > concern, since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything > old and new, but that was what was wanted. > > The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > membership: > > Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives > are readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > > As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search > engine page for Xmission hosted public lists; > > http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > > Keith Diehl > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > > > -- *Jeff+* Mol?n labe! ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 15:30:38 -0500 From: Chris Smith <chris.r.smith(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <CAPkEqaiKpbQv2PnDpyb0HAx05ZuhSu=OEtCpE072aVthPdKM0w(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Make the information free! On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:14 PM, August Trometer <atrometer(a)gmail.com>wrote: > Anyone - It will help keep the value UP > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com > [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Keith > Diehl > Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:53 PM > To: Montgomery Boats List > Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives > > In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were > readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and > cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the concern, > since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, but > that was what was wanted. > > The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > membership: > > Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are > readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > > As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine > page for Xmission hosted public lists; > > http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > > Keith Diehl > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > > > -- Chris ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 13:41:26 -0700 From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <ED8EE09D-D9F0-4216-BA21-E1F2B28517B7(a)gte.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I certainly vote for searchable archives. Tom Jenkins M17 Scintilla On Mar 23, 2012, at 1:05 PM, W David Scobie wrote: > keith: > > yes we need to have things searchable. there are lots of good information that needs to be accessible. without that information available one looses the 15+ years of history that is available on the list. > > what needs to be remembered that anything, ANYTHING, you do on the net is public (yes, this includes email and the www-sites you visit) and can be found/searched/read. > > > :: Dave Scobie > :: Sage Marine > > --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: >> >> In the past, some members were very >> concerned that their postings were >> readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public >> viewing and >> cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite >> understood the concern, >> since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything >> old and new, but >> that was what was wanted. >> >> The question of searchable archives has come up again, so >> I'll ask the >> membership: >> >> Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the >> archives are >> readable by anyone on the internet, including search >> engines? >> >> As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker >> search engine page for Xmission hosted public lists; >> >> http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html >> >> Keith Diehl >> Cottonwood Heights, UT >> >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 13:46:52 -0700 From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <4F6CE13C.7050404(a)gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed I agree. I searched the archives before joining the list before I got my M15. Helped with the decision. Daniel On 3/23/2012 1:29 PM, Jeffrey Johnston wrote: > Amen to searchable and open to anyone. What in hell could be so top secret > that we wouldn't want the archives? > > Jeff Johnston > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:14 PM, August Trometer<atrometer(a)gmail.com>wrote: > >> Anyone - It will help keep the value UP >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >> [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Keith >> Diehl >> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:53 PM >> To: Montgomery Boats List >> Subject: M_Boats: Searchable Archives >> >> In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were >> readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and >> cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the concern, >> since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, but >> that was what was wanted. >> >> The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the >> membership: >> >> Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are >> readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? >> >> As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine >> page for Xmission hosted public lists; >> >> http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html >> >> Keith Diehl >> Cottonwood Heights, UT >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 18:37:37 -0400 (EDT) From: GILASAILR(a)aol.com To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <b672.1216f917.3c9e5531(a)aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sounds like MontyLeaks to me. I am for searchable archives - freedom of the press - free speech - women's rights - and free beer. Scooter (no way am I using my real(fake) name after reading Scoobie's post!) ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 15:58:57 -0700 From: Tom Smith <openboatt(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bottom paint Message-ID: <CA+3pONLnmY4vNbtPoQBH+RN8LDrBfy7D3Gs=iwygdWVCvyk8Ew(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I agree with this sentiment. If you have a pristine bottom (I know where you dirty old men are going with this...), my vote is to leave it that way. We keep our late model jerry-built M17 in a slip at the south end of Lake Pend Oreille for 5-6 months. I clean the bottom in the slip maybe once during the season (I wrote up how I do this in SCA # 57), then clean it again in the slip just before I pull it out in the fall (both times with green pads), that way I've just got a bit of cleanup to do over the winter when it's snug in my shop. I've stripped the bottom of an M17 using the method Larry recommends in an earlier post. That's the last time I want to do that, and I suspect initially coating then occasionally re-coating with bottom paint is no treat. To each his own, as they say, but I believe letting well enough alone except in extreme cases makes Jack a relaxed sailboat owner. t On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > We got sick of supporting bottom paint on our Nor'Sea, so we have opted out on the Montgomery. ?On the last trip to the San Juans (I think 18 days in Puget Sound) we got a little slime, but we could rinse it off with a cloth. ?Havasu and its week worth of quagga mussel larvae was a little more intense, but an abrasive pad cleaned the little guys off (easy for me because my wife did it). ?Once you put on bottom paint, I think you are pretty much stuck with it, so think about whether you will ever be in a fouling environment for more than a few weeks. > > Tom > > > On Mar 23, 2012, at 7:29 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > >> rick: >> >> i can't remember from prior posts if you keep your boat in-water for extended periods? >> >> if you don't keep your boat in-water for more than than about a month at a time consider one of the hard and slick bottom coats. ?larry yake uses this type of product on his M17, CORN DOG. ?i'm not sure the product or the details on how it stands up to long periods in water. ?larry does keep his boat in fresh water during the summer when he is not sailing the san juan and northern canadian waters. >> >> larry please share details and this time i'll save your information for my own future boat projet as 'what you did' is what i'm going to do when i decide to get under my M17 SWEET PEA and remove all the flaking bottom paint. >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com >> >> --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> My boat has ablative copper bottom >>> paint that is over five years old, and >>> beginning to wear off. ?One boatyard has suggested >>> removing it with a >>> pressure washer that uses very hot water rather than >>> sanding. ?Does anyone >>> have any experience with this, or comments as to whether >>> it's a good idea >>> or not? ?Any possibility of damage to the >>> surface? ?Would it still have to >>> be sanded before painting? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Rick >>> M17 #633 >>> Lynne L >>> >> > > ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 19:00:01 -0400 From: Michael Murphy <mikeandpaula48(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <CAE9+wJNz7GcGtemZ2LN19FRi4vhAUANJRECb5sqsmSRG6=OSAA(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Please keep them searchable. On 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: > In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were > readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and > cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the concern, > since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, but > that was what was wanted. > > The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > membership: > > Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are > readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > > As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine > page for Xmission hosted public lists; > > http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > > Keith Diehl > Cottonwood Heights, UT > > > ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 16:15:22 -0700 From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bottom paint Message-ID: <F4F82BCA530247E38C1CFD41C10DB020@jerryws10> Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type="original" Tom, is there an y message in using "pristine bottom", dirty old men", and "jerry" in the same paragraph? jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt(a)gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:58 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bottom paint I agree with this sentiment. If you have a pristine bottom (I know where you dirty old men are going with this...), my vote is to leave it that way. We keep our late model jerry-built M17 in a slip at the south end of Lake Pend Oreille for 5-6 months. I clean the bottom in the slip maybe once during the season (I wrote up how I do this in SCA # 57), then clean it again in the slip just before I pull it out in the fall (both times with green pads), that way I've just got a bit of cleanup to do over the winter when it's snug in my shop. I've stripped the bottom of an M17 using the method Larry recommends in an earlier post. That's the last time I want to do that, and I suspect initially coating then occasionally re-coating with bottom paint is no treat. To each his own, as they say, but I believe letting well enough alone except in extreme cases makes Jack a relaxed sailboat owner. t On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > We got sick of supporting bottom paint on our Nor'Sea, so we have opted > out on the Montgomery. On the last trip to the San Juans (I think 18 days > in Puget Sound) we got a little slime, but we could rinse it off with a > cloth. Havasu and its week worth of quagga mussel larvae was a little more > intense, but an abrasive pad cleaned the little guys off (easy for me > because my wife did it). Once you put on bottom paint, I think you are > pretty much stuck with it, so think about whether you will ever be in a > fouling environment for more than a few weeks. > > Tom > > > On Mar 23, 2012, at 7:29 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > >> rick: >> >> i can't remember from prior posts if you keep your boat in-water for >> extended periods? >> >> if you don't keep your boat in-water for more than than about a month at >> a time consider one of the hard and slick bottom coats. larry yake uses >> this type of product on his M17, CORN DOG. i'm not sure the product or >> the details on how it stands up to long periods in water. larry does keep >> his boat in fresh water during the summer when he is not sailing the san >> juan and northern canadian waters. >> >> larry please share details and this time i'll save your information for >> my own future boat projet as 'what you did' is what i'm going to do when >> i decide to get under my M17 SWEET PEA and remove all the flaking bottom >> paint. >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com >> >> --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> My boat has ablative copper bottom >>> paint that is over five years old, and >>> beginning to wear off. One boatyard has suggested >>> removing it with a >>> pressure washer that uses very hot water rather than >>> sanding. Does anyone >>> have any experience with this, or comments as to whether >>> it's a good idea >>> or not? Any possibility of damage to the >>> surface? Would it still have to >>> be sanded before painting? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Rick >>> M17 #633 >>> Lynne L >>> >> > > -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. We are a community of 7 million users fighting spam. SPAMfighter has removed 6323 of my spam emails to date. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len The Professional version does not have this message ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 21:54:13 -0400 From: Bill Wickett <billwick(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <CAFd5cD=Vy0r0JNQ5Mw-CmJ4Yp4HCH6OCm0aC8-ODWwzf6gLSyA(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Yes please. Thanks for bringing this to our attention Keith and asking. On 3/23/12, Michael Murphy <mikeandpaula48(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Please keep them searchable. > > On 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: >> In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were >> readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and >> cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the concern, >> since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, >> but >> that was what was wanted. >> >> The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the >> membership: >> >> Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are >> readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? >> >> As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search engine >> page for Xmission hosted public lists; >> >> http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html >> >> Keith Diehl >> Cottonwood Heights, UT >> >> >> > > ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 19:41:45 -0700 From: Tom Smith <openboatt(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bottom paint Message-ID: <CA+3pONL0GSJK6kK6jVbP5z+mq7Noac4V9z_R-6KeqOyWZZBd9w(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 You may draw your own conclusions big boy... t On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 4:15 PM, jerry montgomery <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> wrote: > Tom, is there an y message in using "pristine bottom", dirty old men", and > "jerry" in the same paragraph? > > jerry > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt(a)gmail.com> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 3:58 PM > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bottom paint > > > I agree with this sentiment. ?If you have a pristine bottom (I know > where you dirty old men are going with this...), my vote is to leave > it that way. ?We keep our late model jerry-built M17 in a slip at the > south end of Lake Pend Oreille for 5-6 months. ?I clean the bottom in > the slip maybe once during the season (I wrote up how I do this in SCA > # 57), then clean it again in the slip just before I pull it out in > the fall (both times with green pads), that way I've just got a bit of > cleanup to do over the winter when it's snug in my shop. > > I've stripped the bottom of an M17 using the method Larry recommends > in an earlier post. ?That's the last time I want to do that, and I > suspect initially coating then occasionally re-coating with bottom > paint is no treat. > > To each his own, as they say, but I believe letting well enough alone > except in extreme cases makes Jack a relaxed sailboat owner. ?t > > > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 12:54 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> We got sick of supporting bottom paint on our Nor'Sea, so we have opted >> out on the Montgomery. On the last trip to the San Juans (I think 18 days in >> Puget Sound) we got a little slime, but we could rinse it off with a cloth. >> Havasu and its week worth of quagga mussel larvae was a little more intense, >> but an abrasive pad cleaned the little guys off (easy for me because my wife >> did it). Once you put on bottom paint, I think you are pretty much stuck >> with it, so think about whether you will ever be in a fouling environment >> for more than a few weeks. >> >> Tom >> >> >> On Mar 23, 2012, at 7:29 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> rick: >>> >>> i can't remember from prior posts if you keep your boat in-water for >>> extended periods? >>> >>> if you don't keep your boat in-water for more than than about a month at >>> a time consider one of the hard and slick bottom coats. larry yake uses this >>> type of product on his M17, CORN DOG. i'm not sure the product or the >>> details on how it stands up to long periods in water. larry does keep his >>> boat in fresh water during the summer when he is not sailing the san juan >>> and northern canadian waters. >>> >>> larry please share details and this time i'll save your information for >>> my own future boat projet as 'what you did' is what i'm going to do when i >>> decide to get under my M17 SWEET PEA and remove all the flaking bottom >>> paint. >>> >>> >>> :: Dave Scobie >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>> :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com >>> >>> --- On Fri, 3/23/12, Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> My boat has ablative copper bottom >>>> paint that is over five years old, and >>>> beginning to wear off. One boatyard has suggested >>>> removing it with a >>>> pressure washer that uses very hot water rather than >>>> sanding. Does anyone >>>> have any experience with this, or comments as to whether >>>> it's a good idea >>>> or not? Any possibility of damage to the >>>> surface? Would it still have to >>>> be sanded before painting? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Rick >>>> M17 #633 >>>> Lynne L >>>> >>> >> >> > > > > -- > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. > We are a community of 7 million users fighting spam. > SPAMfighter has removed 6323 of my spam emails to date. > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len > > The Professional version does not have this message > > > ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 20:31:06 -0700 From: Bill Day <bill(a)gotrain.org> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <CABVZyiPAUbt7=cX0o0X_iyr9uaT4ncBzo9eHOyHrQoSw5L-m5Q(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Free the archives!!! Bill Day On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:54 PM, Bill Wickett <billwick(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Yes please. Thanks for bringing this to our attention Keith and asking. > > On 3/23/12, Michael Murphy <mikeandpaula48(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Please keep them searchable. > > > > On 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: > >> In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were > >> readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and > >> cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the > concern, > >> since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, > >> but > >> that was what was wanted. > >> > >> The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > >> membership: > >> > >> Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are > >> readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > >> > >> As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search > engine > >> page for Xmission hosted public lists; > >> > >> http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > >> > >> Keith Diehl > >> Cottonwood Heights, UT > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 22:04:31 -0700 From: Ed <whitehead361(a)gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Message-ID: <7167069445B14BC9A79786CDAE2BF0B9@userPC> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original When I was first thinking about buying a small boat, I searched the internet. And, based on the discussions, experiences, questions, and photos, I eventually settled on a Montgomery 17. I think you provide information for possible new Monty owners by having all the information available to those who need it. ;-) - Ed -----Original Message----- From: Bill Day Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 8:31 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Searchable Archives Free the archives!!! Bill Day On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:54 PM, Bill Wickett <billwick(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Yes please. Thanks for bringing this to our attention Keith and asking. > > On 3/23/12, Michael Murphy <mikeandpaula48(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Please keep them searchable. > > > > On 3/23/12, Keith Diehl <kdiehl(a)xmission.com> wrote: > >> In the past, some members were very concerned that their postings were > >> readable by non-members, so I closed the archives to public viewing and > >> cancelled our searchable archives. I never quite understood the > concern, > >> since anyone can join the mailing and then read everything old and new, > >> but > >> that was what was wanted. > >> > >> The question of searchable archives has come up again, so I'll ask the > >> membership: > >> > >> Would you like to have searchable archives if it means the archives are > >> readable by anyone on the internet, including search engines? > >> > >> As an example of what we could have, here is the main Lurker search > engine > >> page for Xmission hosted public lists; > >> > >> http://mailman.xmission.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html > >> > >> Keith Diehl > >> Cottonwood Heights, UT > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2012 17:43:12 -0500 From: Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Fenders Message-ID: <CAFS5qAvdZKvP2YwzD=SVgDyYmHKv_L+aLDGEda455Rpj5nihcQ(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 OK, for fear of sounding pretty dumb, I dared not ask until now: As a new M15 owner, a boat without lifelines, how are folks hanging fenders? I can hang one vertical from my single slot teak handhold. Maybe one from the sidestay. But, those two would be quite close together. Then what?? OK, go ahead and make fun of me it you want. :) Padre Jeff ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ montgomery_boats mailing list montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 109, Issue 19 *************************************************

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Filling, Fairing and Painting
by Jeffrey Johnston 26 Mar '12

26 Mar '12

My M15 has a few gouges and scratches on the forward end sides and bottom of the keel. I will be filling/fairing these with a) West System with micro fiber filler *or* b) Evercoat Formula 27 Filler. Which would you use? Second, these filled areas must be finish painted (I believe). What paint (or ought it be Gelcoat) would you use beneath the waterline on this job? I have no bottom paint on my boat. Thanks again....... *Jeff+* Molōn labe!

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Fenders
by Stan Winarski 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

I've installed a couple of stainless steel eye straps under the joint between the deck and hull to which I can hook bumpers. Although that works well if I had it to do over again (which I just might do anyway) I'd merely fasten them to the side of the toe rail where they would be easier to find and clip on to when trying to do it while singlehanded as you are approaching a dock. Stan 1981 #177 Carol II

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Re: M_Boats: Monty 15 Sails
by TOMMYVAL＠aol.com 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

Larry Thanks for the heads up, I will check it out. Gary In a message dated 3/25/2012 5:40:39 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, leyake(a)juno.com writes: Gary, Regarding your newly cleaned sails, check to see if they have been re-resined. I've had a couple sails cleaned there. They came back looking great, and then promptly stretched out of shape once I started using them. Had my sailmaker check them and he said that all the resin had been removed. Larry On Sun, 25 Mar 2012 15:22:57 -0400 (EDT) TOMMYVAL(a)aol.com writes: > Fr. Jeff > > How old are your sails? I still have original sails on my 1993 M17 > and even > tho the boat is almost 20 years I have I only sailed her maybe > 100-125 > times in this period. She has been very lightly used due to a > number of > reasons. I decided to send my sails off to Sail Care in Ford City, > Pa to get them > reset and cleaned up. They came back about a month ago and I'm > telling you > they look brand new. Check out their web site: _www.sailcare.com_ > (http://www.sailcare.com) or if you call 1-800-433-7245 ask for > Jerry, he's an > upright guy and will provide you with good info. > > Really did a great job and I have no affiliation with them other > than being > a satisfied customer. > > Thanks > > Gary Valetti > M17 > > Should be back in the water this summer, got the sails done, new > rigging > and the centerboard pennant is next, bottom paint and ready to go. > Looking > forward to it. > > > > > In a message dated 3/25/2012 3:04:29 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > frjeff(a)gmail.com writes: > > Although I have sailed for years, I have never purchased a new suit > of > sails. > I am highly confused by the plethora of lofts available when > Googled. > > So, for day sailing, inland lakes and near shore Great Lakes > sailing, I > believe I do not need the finest/most expensive sails available. I > am > looking for value - quality sails, suited to my usage, at a > fair/reasonable > price. But, what cloth weight, loft, etc.?? > I am located in MI if that's important. > > I am asking your input. Perhaps, if you have strong negatives > toward any > lofts, it might be best to privately email me. > > I thank you in advance for your anticipated wise consul. > > Fr. Jeff > > >

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Re: M_Boats: Monty 15 Sails
by Larry E Yake 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

Gary, Regarding your newly cleaned sails, check to see if they have been re-resined. I've had a couple sails cleaned there. They came back looking great, and then promptly stretched out of shape once I started using them. Had my sailmaker check them and he said that all the resin had been removed. Larry On Sun, 25 Mar 2012 15:22:57 -0400 (EDT) TOMMYVAL(a)aol.com writes: > Fr. Jeff > > How old are your sails? I still have original sails on my 1993 M17 > and even > tho the boat is almost 20 years I have I only sailed her maybe > 100-125 > times in this period. She has been very lightly used due to a > number of > reasons. I decided to send my sails off to Sail Care in Ford City, > Pa to get them > reset and cleaned up. They came back about a month ago and I'm > telling you > they look brand new. Check out their web site: _www.sailcare.com_ > (http://www.sailcare.com) or if you call 1-800-433-7245 ask for > Jerry, he's an > upright guy and will provide you with good info. > > Really did a great job and I have no affiliation with them other > than being > a satisfied customer. > > Thanks > > Gary Valetti > M17 > > Should be back in the water this summer, got the sails done, new > rigging > and the centerboard pennant is next, bottom paint and ready to go. > Looking > forward to it. > > > > > In a message dated 3/25/2012 3:04:29 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > frjeff(a)gmail.com writes: > > Although I have sailed for years, I have never purchased a new suit > of > sails. > I am highly confused by the plethora of lofts available when > Googled. > > So, for day sailing, inland lakes and near shore Great Lakes > sailing, I > believe I do not need the finest/most expensive sails available. I > am > looking for value - quality sails, suited to my usage, at a > fair/reasonable > price. But, what cloth weight, loft, etc.?? > I am located in MI if that's important. > > I am asking your input. Perhaps, if you have strong negatives > toward any > lofts, it might be best to privately email me. > > I thank you in advance for your anticipated wise consul. > > Fr. Jeff > > >

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Re: M_Boats: Monty 15 Sails
by W David Scobie 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

jeff: there are lots of opinions out there on what is the 'best' sail for any boat. as already stated, harry with Elliot/Pattision Sailmakers knows jerry's boats. the sails are also made in the USA. www.epsails.com the following is important no matter which loft you choose - you will need make a few basic sail measurements to confirm the size of your boat's standing rigging to make a correctly sized set. no matter which loft you choose be sure to measure the boat. there are a few differences between the M15s depending on year built and modifications made by prior owners. so, still measure the boat even if the loft has M15 measurements on file. the lengths to confirm to see if you 15 is 'standard' are - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sail-plan#Sail-plan_measurements with the mast up measure P, I and J measure E as the length of the boom from the gooseneck (attached to the mast) to the outhaul block, and measure the current main's foot. doing this gives some comparative information on how the current main was cut and how much it has stretched. using the current jib measure LP. harry will look at these numbers to see if your boat is 'standard'. i recommend you get a footless main and look into improving the boom's outhaul hardware so you can better adjust the main's draft. also have a cunningham grommet installed so you can adjust the main's luff. i also recommend a double-reef main. this in part depends on what winds you sail. for cruising and casual sailing the M15 likes a reef as the wind approaches 12-13 knots. a second reef is good as the wind goes above 17-18 knots. after you have put in the second reef in the main then think about reducing the headsail size. :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-name-scred :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com --- On Sun, 3/25/12, Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Although I have sailed for years, I > have never purchased a new suit of > sails. > I am highly confused by the plethora of lofts available when > Googled. > > So, for day sailing, inland lakes and near shore Great Lakes > sailing, I > believe I do not need the finest/most expensive sails > available. I am > looking for value - quality sails, suited to my usage, at a > fair/reasonable > price. But, what cloth weight, loft, etc.?? > I am located in MI if that's important. > > I am asking your input. Perhaps, if you have strong > negatives toward any > lofts, it might be best to privately email me. > > I thank you in advance for your anticipated wise consul. > > Fr. Jeff >

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Re: M_Boats: Monty 15 Sails
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

Jeff, Our own beloved PaintBoy has very close connections to a sail loft - contact him and see what they can do, Local Monty guy and coatings guru to boot! He is pretty good sailor too. Elliot/Pattison - has done much good work for Montgomery boats. On my boat for new sails I have used Ullman/Newport Beach for decades - Made in America - and at any level (cruise/race/GP) you desire - ask for Keith Magnussen. Good lofts make good sails whether they be race or cruise - NFIW - just good people who support the sport and our boats. SOmetimes 'bulk' purchase will garner a discount - multiple sails M,J,G. Nothing like new sails for enhanced performance - higher,faster,flatter -it is all good! GO M-17 Ohhhboy! sail # 354 'your mileage may vary if you pound the loud pedal'

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Monty 15 Sails
by Jeffrey Johnston 25 Mar '12

25 Mar '12

Although I have sailed for years, I have never purchased a new suit of sails. I am highly confused by the plethora of lofts available when Googled. So, for day sailing, inland lakes and near shore Great Lakes sailing, I believe I do not need the finest/most expensive sails available. I am looking for value - quality sails, suited to my usage, at a fair/reasonable price. But, what cloth weight, loft, etc.?? I am located in MI if that's important. I am asking your input. Perhaps, if you have strong negatives toward any lofts, it might be best to privately email me. I thank you in advance for your anticipated wise consul. Fr. Jeff

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