November 2009 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Pondering a tiller pilot
by Gordon Gilbert 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

One of the upgrades I've been considering for my M-17 is a tiller pilot. However, I have mixed feelings about such a device as I enjoy the intimacy with the water environment a small craft allows--and I wonder if too much "automation" will detract from that. Plus, I believe in the KISS approach to boat-keeping. But on a couple of cruises this past summer I had some long stretches of motoring (six hours returning from Isle Royale) or hours-long no-tacking sailing legs where a tiller pilot would have allowed me to brew a cup of joe or make a sandwich or just enjoy the view from the boat's bow. Having said all of that, I'm curious as to how many Monty owners have installed tiller pilots on their boats. If you have, what brand did you choose, how did the installation go and how has it worked out? Does the pilot work well? Do you use it as much as you anticipated? I would enjoy getting your input, advice or opinions. Thanks! Gordon '83 M-17 #377 "Sapphire" Milwaukee, WI

11 15

Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15
by Neil Dorf 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

More gas to pull the boat up there but the summer winds tend to be more consistent and at that altitude it's abou 10 degrees cooler so less bob 'n bake. Scott's Flat is also encircled with pine trees and I think it is a prettier venue. I sailed in October and one of the two courtesy docks were still in the water. There is at least one Cat22 that sails up there and there is plenty of area to sail an M15 but not nearly as large an area as Folsom. It is also more of a round shape so plenty of room to navigate around. No I don,t have a permanent swim ladder but it is on my list of enhancements. I will probably get a quote from Mel to do it as I would be very nervous about drilling those holes... If I don't get it done in time for Havasu I'll get a rope ladder like the one Bill Tosh sells at www.tcboats.com For $20 Neil Dorf -----Original Message----- From: "Hughston, Larry" <Larry.Hughston(a)dgs.ca.gov> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: 11/18/2009 12:32 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15 I am sticking with Brown's Ravine at Folsom until I can get my jib lines run back to the cockpit. I am still at the drill and fill and drill again stage with my deck hardware. Have not sailed Scotts Flat. What was your impression when you sailed there? Do you have a permanent transom ladder? ---Larry -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of ndorf(a)surfbest.net Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2009 9:58 AM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15 Larry, best of luck with that repair. BTW since you are a fellow Sacramento sailor, perhaps we'll meet up sometime in the area. I've only had my M15 since August, and the two places I've sailed most have been Folsom Lake and (upper) Scotts Flat Reservoir. I hope to do more sailing around the Delta in 2010 and am curious about sailing out of Owl Harbor. Have you sailed out of there, or any other suggestions? Regards, Neil _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

2 1

Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15
by ndorf＠surfbest.net 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

Larry, best of luck with that repair. BTW since you are a fellow Sacramento sailor, perhaps we'll meet up sometime in the area. I've only had my M15 since August, and the two places I've sailed most have been Folsom Lake and (upper) Scotts Flat Reservoir. I hope to do more sailing around the Delta in 2010 and am curious about sailing out of Owl Harbor. Have you sailed out of there, or any other suggestions? Regards, Neil

2 1

Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15
by Steve R. 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

Bob, I have come to the reluctant conclusion that no matter how hard I rub them, my cleats will never be shiny again. How many boating units must I ask Santa to set aside to purchase a new stern cleat? Or bow cleat? The holes will match, right? While we are at it, how much is a centerboard? I really appreciate you contribution to the list and the input from Jerry. steve Steve R. M-15 #119 Lexington, KY Bob From California wrote: saw too many of the old style cleats broken so we switched to Stainless steel. In fact, the entire boat is stainless. Cast stainless is light, shiny and strong. Several people have switched out the aluminum cleats for stainless. Bob

2 1

Re: M_Boats: Broken cleat, M-15
by ndorf＠surfbest.net 18 Nov '09

18 Nov '09

Larry, Now that you mention it, I *was* curious how it would come to be that the cleat needed to be replaced. Seems to me you would need some serious fiberglass work before that cleat would break. I once came dangerously close to pulling the boat out of the water on the trailer and due to distractions on the dock, NOT undoing the bow line. Thankfully as I ever so gently taped the accelerator I was looking back over my shoulder and saw the line tighten. Averted disaster, as it normally would have been my nature to push harder on the accelerator. Valuable lesson learned. I was not so fortunate sailing too close to shore and busting my rudder blade, which is under repair currently :-( By the way don't be so hard on yourself and stay out of the 'flog' shop. Go with the 'flag' shop. :-) Neil

2 1

Re: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot
by Jim Ellsworth 17 Nov '09

17 Nov '09

Joe, I don't have the info in front of me but it really does not use that much juice unless it is fighting for control in following seas. I had dual batteries in my WWP-19 and I had the unit on for 6.5 hours going to Catalina, spent three days on the island and used the auto pilot all the way back, another 6.5 hours and the battery had plenty of juice left. I also used it on my M-17 (with only one battery) in the San Juan Islands last June for 15 days and had no problems (that includes shore power to re-charge every couple of nights). I also had a kit put into my Honda 5HP that charges the battery. Again I don't have the spec's but as I recall the charge from the motor just about covers the the autopilot usage. The tillerpilot has an autopilot mode and a standby mode, so I leave it on standby and disconnect it from the tiller then when I need it I just pop it back on the tiller, hit the auto button and I am good to go. If I find the spec's I will post them, but you can also go to Raymarine's web site and probably get the data there as well. I did have a tiller tamer on my P-15 and P-19. Did not work well on the P-15 (move your weight and off the boat goes in a new direction). It was better on the P-19, but I got a new Ida Sailor rudder and tiller for the M-17 and did not want to mount a bunch of stuff on the new tiller. I was able to measure for the auto pilot and just have the attachment pin on the tiller without the need to mount a bracket to the tiller. Your simple tiller tamer sounds great I may try that for those times I may not want to get the autopilot out. I just took some pictures of my autopilot set up for another guy so if you are interested let me know and I will e-mail them to you. Jim Ellsworth M-17 #603 Grace -----Original Message----- >From: Joe Murphy <seagray(a)embarqmail.com> >Sent: Nov 17, 2009 4:27 PM >To: Jim Ellsworth <j_ellsworth(a)earthlink.net>, For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot > >Jim, >How much battery power do you have to run the ST1000? I always thought that >tiller pilots were resource hogs. How long can you run with one on. When >you don't use the ST1000 can you leave it attached and still hand steer or >do you have to uncouple it?? >I have the Tiller Tamer and I use it all the time. Never know when >something unexpected pops up and you have to let go the tiller. I keep mine >tensioned just enough to keep a course but still hand steer. >Joe >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Jim Ellsworth" <j_ellsworth(a)earthlink.net> >To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" ><montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com>; "For and about Montgomery >Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >Sent: Tuesday, November 17, 2009 1:59 PM >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot > > >>I have a ST-1000 that I transferred from my WWP-19 and I could not live >>with out it. >> >> I do not have the GPS tied into it I just use it as my "crew" when I am >> pulling up fenders, making sail adjustments, or as you suggest letting it >> steer while I take in the view. >> >> The unit does have a tacking function which would also be great for >> singlehanding, but I have not been able to get that feature to work so >> far. >> >> For just holding a cource the unit works great, and only gets chalanging >> in a following sea. >> >> Not too hard to install, there are various brackets and hardware you can >> get to set it up just right. >> >> Jim Ellsworth >> M-17 #603 Grace >> >> -----Original Message----- >>>From: Gordon Gilbert <Gordon(a)FinancialWriting.net> >>>Sent: Nov 17, 2009 10:33 AM >>>To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>><montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>>Subject: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot >>> >>>One of the upgrades I've been considering for my M-17 is a tiller pilot. >>>However, I have mixed feelings about such a device as I enjoy the intimacy >>>with the water environment a small craft allows--and I wonder if too >>>much "automation" will detract from that. Plus, I believe in the KISS >>>approach to boat-keeping. But on a couple of cruises this past summer I >>>had some long stretches of motoring (six hours returning from Isle Royale) >>>or hours-long no-tacking sailing legs where a tiller pilot would have >>>allowed me to brew a cup of joe or make a sandwich or just enjoy the view >>>from the boat's bow. >>> >>>Having said all of that, I'm curious as to how many Monty owners have >>>installed tiller pilots on their boats. If you have, what brand did you >>>choose, how did the installation go and how has it worked out? Does the >>>pilot work well? Do you use it as much as you anticipated? I would enjoy >>>getting your input, advice or opinions. Thanks! >>> >>>Gordon >>>'83 M-17 #377 "Sapphire" >>>Milwaukee, WI >>> >>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>> >>>Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >> >> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >

2 1

Re: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot
by Jim Ellsworth 17 Nov '09

17 Nov '09

I have a ST-1000 that I transferred from my WWP-19 and I could not live with out it. I do not have the GPS tied into it I just use it as my "crew" when I am pulling up fenders, making sail adjustments, or as you suggest letting it steer while I take in the view. The unit does have a tacking function which would also be great for singlehanding, but I have not been able to get that feature to work so far. For just holding a cource the unit works great, and only gets chalanging in a following sea. Not too hard to install, there are various brackets and hardware you can get to set it up just right. Jim Ellsworth M-17 #603 Grace -----Original Message----- >From: Gordon Gilbert <Gordon(a)FinancialWriting.net> >Sent: Nov 17, 2009 10:33 AM >To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >Subject: M_Boats: Pondering a tiller pilot > >One of the upgrades I've been considering for my M-17 is a tiller pilot. However, I have mixed feelings about such a device as I enjoy the intimacy with the water environment a small craft allows--and I wonder if too much "automation" will detract from that. Plus, I believe in the KISS approach to boat-keeping. But on a couple of cruises this past summer I had some long stretches of motoring (six hours returning from Isle Royale) or hours-long no-tacking sailing legs where a tiller pilot would have allowed me to brew a cup of joe or make a sandwich or just enjoy the view from the boat's bow. > >Having said all of that, I'm curious as to how many Monty owners have installed tiller pilots on their boats. If you have, what brand did you choose, how did the installation go and how has it worked out? Does the pilot work well? Do you use it as much as you anticipated? I would enjoy getting your input, advice or opinions. Thanks! > >Gordon >'83 M-17 #377 "Sapphire" >Milwaukee, WI > > >_______________________________________________ >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

4 3

Ham radio on M-15
by jim sadler 17 Nov '09

17 Nov '09

Any of you skippers operating a ham radio aboard M-15? What are you doing for power and antenna? Captain Jim Sadler sailing vessel pelican --

2 2

Re: M_Boats: M-23 wanted
by bownez＠juno.com 16 Nov '09

16 Nov '09

There are three in Minnesota, and a couple in WI I believe. Where are you located Robbin? Bones in Mpls ____________________________________________________________ Doctorate Degrees Online Boost your career with an online doctoral degree. Enroll today! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2141/c?cp=9bCyE6YNldvI645e-vNMMwAAJ1ApM…

1 0

Inside line latch
by Rick Langer 16 Nov '09

16 Nov '09

Tod, how does that latch line work? Does it run to a cleat in the cabin? Thanks, Rick M15 #337 Bluebird

3 2