Mainstream, the new Avant Garde? The "best of" lists have thrown up a few intresting confessions. Anyone else prepared to come clean with a "guilty pleasures" best of?
The use of the term "guilty pleasures" in conjunction with the appearance of mainstream albums on various top 10 lists is exactly what I don't like about many avant-garde listeners' attitudes to music. They feel that their taste in music is so elevated that you can only justify listening to non-avant-garde music by wrapping it in a package of postmodern irony. This approach does nothing but continue the age-old supposed dichotomy between high art and low art, a canyon still wide open. As for myself, I didn't put the Kylie Minogue album in my top 10 as a "guilty pleasure". Sure, I take much pleasure in listening to it, but I don't feel guilty about it, and I certainly don't feel I need to justify my appreciation of the album by resorting to irony or anything of the sort - to me, it's a just a very good pop album, with some killer tunes. I also do not need to find any hidden references to avant-culture in it that "the general public probably don't get" to justify why I think it is a good album (even though the opening track and first single "Slow" could certainly be accused of being influenced by minimal electronics, for instance). To me, it is simply a good album, one that I have played a lot since I bought it. As Zorn has said it himself, the avant-garde has become a genre all unto itself. In much so-called experimental music, there isn't much experiment going on, because most of what is being played or produced has been done many times already. The only thing that makes it being tagged experimental is that 99.5% of the audience haven't heard any of the other 50,000 albums out there that use extended techniques, noise, scraping sounds, non-linear structures, and electronics in combination with acoustic instruments, to name but a few elements from the dictionary of the "weird". Quality is a rare thing, both in pop music and in experimental music (I'd like to think of Stanley Zappa's rants in Bananafish here...). To me, it no longer matters whether an album is from the pop or the avant world for me to appreciate it. As long as I feel excited about it, and have the urge to put it in my CD player, I reckon it's a good album. That being said, anyone else on this list who is into Broadcast as much as I am (and actually thinks they are the best band around these days)? Frankco
Hi,
They
feel that their taste in music is so elevated that you can only justify listening to non-avant-garde music by wrapping it in a package of postmodern irony. This approach does nothing but continue the age-old supposed dichotomy between high art and low art, a canyon still wide open.
100% agreed. But I'm not so sure whether this this "dichotomy" is "supposed" or "real". I also find Kylie Minogue to be very appealing and catchy. I'm not sure if I have any reasons/justifications -maybe I find her music to be incredibly sexy, but I guess it's something more spontaneous than that. That said, I think it's nocive to draw dividing lines between high artistry and commercial music. Both might come hand in hand (just every once in a while) and you probably cannot speak in general terms but you have to consider every case. However, as we discussed here some days ago, I don't think mainstream pop music is offering too much these days and I can't think of any musicians in that field who are actively blending art and commerciality as, say, Beatles did 30-something years ago. Some names came up: Radiohead, Björk, Beck and even Sonic Youth, but I think these guys are playing in a totally different league and they're not on the hunt for the "summer song". I also do not need to find
any hidden references to avant-culture in it that "the general public probably don't get" to justify why I think it is a good album
The point isn't maybe seeing what others can't see, but getting pointed to new directions through a particular artist. Quentin Tarantino, for example, who's an incredibly popular person, had lots of us looking for blaxploitation, kung-fu or film noir/low-profile gangster movies. It's not necessarily a post-modernist possee. Or maybe it is, but I double-checked some popular genres thanks to him and that I find very enrichening. "Slow" is a great single, but I think Minogue is just entertaining, and I'll probably forget that tune in a couple of months. Or even worse, it will be outdated in three years. In a completely different environment, following Zorn's career or just reading the liner notes to his albums you can get enough information to read, listen and watch for years.
As Zorn has said it himself, the avant-garde has become a genre all unto itself. In much so-called experimental music, there isn't much experiment going on, because most of what is being played or produced has been done many times already.
Not to speak about free-improv... The only thing that makes
it being tagged experimental is that 99.5% of the audience haven't heard any of the other 50,000 albums out there that use extended techniques, noise, scraping sounds, non-linear structures, and electronics in combination with acoustic instruments, to name but a few elements from the dictionary of the "weird".
A very good appreciation here, imho, but I'd rather make a distinction between "truly innovative" and "experimental", and the former is much more difficult to achieve in any field.
That being said, anyone else on this list who is into Broadcast as much as I am (and actually thinks they are the best band around these days)?
There's a lot of excitement about them and it's certainly difficult not to stumble upon their Cds at the record stores here. There must be something about them I guess. Best, Efrén del Valle _______________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sorteos ¡Ya puedes comprar LoterÃa de Navidad! http://yahoo.ventura24.es/
participants (3)
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Efrén del Valle -
francko.lamerikx＠philips.com -
SELC - Andrew Mortensen