If one has no intention of buying a particular album how does making a copy of that record take any money out of your labels/artists pockeet? If they were never going to buy it anyway, their money would have never existed for you.
Fine. If they aren't going to buy it, then they shouldn't buy it. No one is suggesting that anyone buy something that they don't want to buy and 'consume'. But they shouldn't be able to USE it if they don't buy it. That's the way the admittedly imperfect system works. If they are downloading or copying it and USING it (notice I am saying USING it - obviously if someone copies one of my releases 1,000 times and does absolutely NOTHING with it other than break the CDR in half after burning, then it is NOT having any adverse affect on me), then it's stealing. Period. Don't like my thinking on this? Fine. Ignore this posting. But it's still stealing. Don't try and argue/rationalize your way out of it. And don't say "I am tired of reading this stuff, and don't want to see it any more on this list". What you are really saying is "you are challenging my rationalization, and I don't like that". Again - you think it's ok? I can't convince you otherwise. And as Craig pointed out, it is very easy to copy CDs and because it is so easy, people seem to think it's 'ok'. But bottom line is that (1) the law is on my side in this argument as I am making it here and (2) neither I, nor the artists I represent think it's ok. We think you are stealing from us and we think you are doing something that you know is wrong and either you don't care because you are basically a nasty shifty shithead or you are someone who is able to convince themselves that because it *is* easy that it is ok. And if I am making someone uncomfortable with these postings, then that is precisely my point. Steve Cuneiform Records
Hi, I have been following this argument for a while on this forum and for a very long time chronologically. I am 58 and have been interested in "new music " for a long time. Prior to this era cassette copying was rampant. Before cassettes there was copying by cartridge (!) and before that reel to reel. With the advent of the burner that too was initially difficult and now could not be easier. The pattern is that it has become easier. This somehow alters the boundaries of ethical judgement. The law is the law and until it changes it is what we have. Therefore to copy is illegal. Morally it is simple - the property intellectually belongs to someone else, we have no right to take it. We go to extraordinary lengths to justify our positions in order to feel ok about breaking legal and moral codes and so we invent a sliding scale of justifications to enable us to deal with our aquisitiveness. In it's extreme form it ends up with Bush's view of Iraq or China's view of Tibet. Being an old left winger - in soccer and politics - I feel that this is the inevitable result of the Capitalist society we live in. I think the only way forward is to devise a method of somehow compensating the artists. This has been argued since Guttenberg! I too am in that moral dilemna - I do not usually copy things but have a sliding scale of ethical justifications to deal with when I do. Years ago a judge said to me it is no different to steal office stationery than to steal money out of the till. And we all take the occasional paper clip. As for Zorn is he the Mick Jagger of the A.G.? Should he retire? Do I have to listen to another live Masada? How many letters are there in the Jewish alphabet? regards, Billy
And don't say "I am tired of reading this stuff, and don't want to see it any more on this list". What you are really saying is "you are challenging my rationalization, and I don't like that".
(1) the law is on my side in this argument as I am making it here
and
(2) neither I, nor the artists I represent think it's ok. We think you are stealing from us and we think you are doing something that you know is wrong and either you don't care because you are basically a nasty shifty shithead or you are someone who is able to convince themselves that because it *is* easy that it is ok.
And if I am making someone uncomfortable with these postings, then that is precisely my point.
Steve Cuneiform Records
--
participants (2)
-
CuneiWay＠aol.com -
Sibree/Wilkes