No, I would not call Vandermark insipid. I have nothing but respect for the man and all he has done for the scene in Chicago. He pulls for unknowns and will play anywhere (even a 15 x 30 room above a noisy bar in Indianapolis to 20 people). I jump at any chance to see Vandermark as it will sure to be a great show. What I meant by my comments is that he sounds (albeit mildly) insipid on album, though there are moments that shine; this is really cast into sharp relief when compared against what he is capable of live. That said, I don't think he touch baritone ;) I have no problems with Vandermark, just how he comes across recorded. If only his studio output could match his live performances. Zach -----Original Message----- From: zorn-list-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:zorn-list-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Craig Lieske Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2003 2:40 PM To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com Subject: Vandermark and Zorn jump cutting examples I don't think you can really call Vandermark "insipid", I'd save that epithet for someone like Everette Harp or that bunch. While he is not an 'innovator" per se, I don't think he's ever claimed to be. I do know that he's open minded and he re-ignited the whole Chicago new scene by himself pretty much. So he gets a huge grant, he worked hard for it. I don't think he's coasting yet, either. st