Group, I want to thank everyone that contributed to my survey concerning astro club growth. There was much to consider and I gleaned enough to do my column in the OAS newsletter. Brent and Deloy had the most obvious "insights", be friendly and have something for all who attend your functions a.k.a all I know about running an astro-club I learned in kindergarten. Deloy, I remember fondly our outings with LVAS at the Gorge. I was back there with them in 2010 and they are still conducting their star party as efficiently as ever. But it is also the same group of people that we knew 14 years ago, which underscores your comments concerning the graying of the hobby. You indicated the same for SLAS, and about half the members of OAS were eyewitness to the Big Bang. I don't know if it is harder to intrigue younger people nowdays, or, if it is not on a screen, i.e. smart phone, ipad, PC, facebook, twitter, angry birds, satellite t.v.,theaters....it is not part of their reality . I will admit that it is a smaller pool of humanity that is interested in astronomy to begin with, so additions to member ship is very incremental. Deloy I was also re-arranging the "stuff" in my garage a couple weeks ago and I came across your Lichtenstein 14x100 binos'. Ya want em back? Ron
Ron: I don't agree that "it is a smaller pool of humanity that is interested in astronomy ". I've tried talking to the young members of SLAS, the ones who will join for a year and never renew. I keep running into them again out at Lakeside and Pit and Pole. They still are and always were interested in the science of Astronomy, they just don't want the social aspects of the clubs. That's the good news bad news of the situation clubs are in today. I've always been an avid armchair astronomer even when my work life didn't allow me to go observing, but I don't find much understanding or even interest in the science among the more seasoned members of the social side of the club scene. The only thing that keeps me in the club is the public outreach we do at Harmons and the grade schools. I'd rather show 50 third graders the craters on the moon than drive to the desert and look at deep space objects with club members. When we stop doing this sidewalk public outreach, I'll be gone from the club too. DT ----- Original Message ----- From: RON VANDERHULE <deepsky100@msn.com> To: utah-astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: Sent: Thursday, January 5, 2012 10:15 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] club growth was club growth Group, I want to thank everyone that contributed to my survey concerning astro club growth. There was much to consider and I gleaned enough to do my column in the OAS newsletter. Brent and Deloy had the most obvious "insights", be friendly and have something for all who attend your functions a.k.a all I know about running an astro-club I learned in kindergarten. Deloy, I remember fondly our outings with LVAS at the Gorge. I was back there with them in 2010 and they are still conducting their star party as efficiently as ever. But it is also the same group of people that we knew 14 years ago, which underscores your comments concerning the graying of the hobby. You indicated the same for SLAS, and about half the members of OAS were eyewitness to the Big Bang. I don't know if it is harder to intrigue younger people nowdays, or, if it is not on a screen, i.e. smart phone, ipad, PC, facebook, twitter, angry birds, satellite t.v.,theaters....it is not part of their reality . I will admit that it is a smaller pool of humanity that is interested in astronomy to begin with, so additions to member ship is very incremental. Deloy I was also re-arranging the "stuff" in my garage a couple weeks ago and I came across your Lichtenstein 14x100 binos'. Ya want em back? Ron _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
Hey Ron: Kay Hargis was kind enough to forward your last issue of "Star Diagonal", and I read your article with interest. I would just add that astronomy is a very time-demanding hobby, and the hours when it must be practiced aren't the most conducive to working people, especially in the current ecconomic/job environment. I can't even make my own club's regular meetings, due to the fact that I have to get up at 4:30 AM Monday through Thursday mornings, so weeknight meetings are impossible unless held on Thursday nights. Plug in some weekend OT (my regular fate, sigh), and even star parties and weekend gatherings become unattendable. Do that for a couple of weeks straight and even when I do get time for club event, I'm so far behind on home activities that I have to spend the time getting caught-up there. Groceries, a running car, a mowed lawn and clean laundry are GOOD things. ;-) Many people today have to hold down more than one job, and many jobs have rotating shifts and odd hours. Students (well, the serious ones, at least) don't have the time for regular meetings, either, especially if they are working their way through school. Their social activities center around coffee shops, texting, and other on-line activities at the oddest of hours. That pretty much leaves us with the "greying" crowd, those nearing the end of long-established careers, those in upper management with much less structured lives and flexible schedules, and the retired. So, I would qualify the reply a couple of people have made that this hobby must draw on a small subset of humanity for membership: Yes and no. I think a lot of people are keenly interested, but the time committment needed for regular club attendance just doesn't mesh with the way society is structured today, in regards to the things I mentioned above. Personally, public outreach has never been my primary motivation in this hobby, though I do my fair share when life allows and enjoy it when I do. I'm just at home alone at the eyepiece or with a small group of friends. Large group activities involving the public and strangers usually don't attract me as much as smaller events with close friends. Kind of a signal-to-noise ratio thing going on there, IMO. Anyway, my 3 cents. Good luck growing the Ogden club! On 1/5/12, RON VANDERHULE <deepsky100@msn.com> wrote:
OK, here's my 1.5 cents' worth: I feel that outreach is a great idea in that it helps to open people's minds to the immediacy of astronomy -- that is, they can look through a telescope and see amazing things themselves, with their own eyes. That is a powerful realization, when astronomy jumps from the realm of the abstract, televised picture into light streaming into their own eyes. It may help people understand a great deal more than that particular view. I see this as a valuable service. But it's different from growing the club. The purpose of the first is helping enlighten people; the purpose of the second idea, growing the club, is recruitment. Frankly, I don't care if people are recruited. If they care enough about astronomy, they may search out a club. If not, and we have simply shown them a larger universe, a bigger idea, that's OK too. -- Joe ________________________________ From: Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2012 10:48 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] club growth was club growth Hey Ron: Kay Hargis was kind enough to forward your last issue of "Star Diagonal", and I read your article with interest. I would just add that astronomy is a very time-demanding hobby, and the hours when it must be practiced aren't the most conducive to working people, especially in the current ecconomic/job environment. I can't even make my own club's regular meetings, due to the fact that I have to get up at 4:30 AM Monday through Thursday mornings, so weeknight meetings are impossible unless held on Thursday nights. Plug in some weekend OT (my regular fate, sigh), and even star parties and weekend gatherings become unattendable. Do that for a couple of weeks straight and even when I do get time for club event, I'm so far behind on home activities that I have to spend the time getting caught-up there. Groceries, a running car, a mowed lawn and clean laundry are GOOD things. ;-) Many people today have to hold down more than one job, and many jobs have rotating shifts and odd hours. Students (well, the serious ones, at least) don't have the time for regular meetings, either, especially if they are working their way through school. Their social activities center around coffee shops, texting, and other on-line activities at the oddest of hours. That pretty much leaves us with the "greying" crowd, those nearing the end of long-established careers, those in upper management with much less structured lives and flexible schedules, and the retired. So, I would qualify the reply a couple of people have made that this hobby must draw on a small subset of humanity for membership: Yes and no. I think a lot of people are keenly interested, but the time committment needed for regular club attendance just doesn't mesh with the way society is structured today, in regards to the things I mentioned above. Personally, public outreach has never been my primary motivation in this hobby, though I do my fair share when life allows and enjoy it when I do. I'm just at home alone at the eyepiece or with a small group of friends. Large group activities involving the public and strangers usually don't attract me as much as smaller events with close friends. Kind of a signal-to-noise ratio thing going on there, IMO. Anyway, my 3 cents. Good luck growing the Ogden club! On 1/5/12, RON VANDERHULE <deepsky100@msn.com> wrote: _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
Great post, Joe, though I'd give you more than 1.5 cents for it. I agree. A club can only do so much in the PR department. A club's focus should always be it's current members. Recruitment is a noble and lofty goal, but astronomy clubs are not churches with proselytizing missionaries going forth to spread the good word, or pyramid schemes gathering new members to go out and recruit even more new members. The science and hobby isn't dependant on grass-roots organizations to guarantee it's existence. Clubs are formed, have a limited lifespan, and die-off. A new club is then formed when the time is right. The current incarnation of SLAS, for example, is not the first astro club in Salt Lake City...nor even the second, nor the third. And it won't be the last. Public outreach and educational events are great, and many members love to help out with these various star-parties. But I contend that they should never be conducted with an eye toward recruitment or expansion. They should be done with love, by those who get nothing more from it than a warm fuzzy. Measuring club growth against activities conducted or energy expended is misguided and bound to disappoint. On 1/7/12, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com> wrote:
OK, here's my 1.5 cents' worth:
Here's the gist of my last post, directed to club officers. Unless your club constitution specifically states that part of your duties are to increase membership, don't sweat it. Your duties are to your current membership, first, foremost and always. They are the ones who elected you. Serve them. Anything beyond that is a feather in your cap, but definitely extra-curricular. Do it for your own pleasure, not as a duty. If you are a club outreach officer, and your constitution states that your duties include increased membership, YOU are the ones who have some work to do. If increased membership is not specifically part of your duties, then just do what you have to do in order to expose the general public to amateur astronomy in as interesting and affable way as you are capable, given the available resources of your club and yourself. The members of the general public who are interested, will come again. No hair-shirts or self-flagellation is required, nor is even serious self-examination.
Increasing membership is not a part of the constitution. Sig On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 4:55 PM, Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com> wrote:
Here's the gist of my last post, directed to club officers.
Unless your club constitution specifically states that part of your duties are to increase membership, don't sweat it.
Your duties are to your current membership, first, foremost and always. They are the ones who elected you. Serve them. Anything beyond that is a feather in your cap, but definitely extra-curricular. Do it for your own pleasure, not as a duty.
If you are a club outreach officer, and your constitution states that your duties include increased membership, YOU are the ones who have some work to do. If increased membership is not specifically part of your duties, then just do what you have to do in order to expose the general public to amateur astronomy in as interesting and affable way as you are capable, given the available resources of your club and yourself.
The members of the general public who are interested, will come again.
No hair-shirts or self-flagellation is required, nor is even serious self-examination.
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
-- Siegfried
participants (5)
-
Chuck Hards -
daniel turner -
Joe Bauman -
RON VANDERHULE -
Siegfried Jachmann