Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe ------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made. Mat -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options". This message and any attachments are solely for the use of intended recipients. The information contained herein may include trade secrets, protected health or personal information, privileged or otherwise confidential information. Unauthorized review, forwarding, printing, copying, distributing, or using such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you received this email in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email and any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the message and any attachment from your system. Thank you for your cooperation
My mom lives in Sun City, I used to drive just past the city limits 90's and observe. The most striking time is seeing parking areas in fog, zero light goes anywhere outside the of the lots. The city of SL is trying but Salt Lake is still very bad in respect to lighting.
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the
mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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This message and any attachments are solely for the use of intended recipients. The information contained herein may include trade secrets, protected health or personal information, privileged or otherwise confidential information. Unauthorized review, forwarding, printing, copying, distributing, or using such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you received this email in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email and any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the message and any attachment from your system. Thank you for your cooperation
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When did the light pollution ordinances in Phoenix begin? As I mentioned, I lived there in the mid to late '80's. A lot has happened since then, I'm sure. Mat -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:28 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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I thought Tucson was the Arizona city with good light ordinances. -- Joe ________________________________ From: "Hutchings, Mat" <mat.hutchings@siemens.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:50 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms When did the light pollution ordinances in Phoenix begin? As I mentioned, I lived there in the mid to late '80's. A lot has happened since then, I'm sure. Mat -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:28 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options". This message and any attachments are solely for the use of intended recipients. The information contained herein may include trade secrets, protected health or personal information, privileged or otherwise confidential information. Unauthorized review, forwarding, printing, copying, distributing, or using such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you received this email in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email and any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the message and any attachment from your system. Thank you for your cooperation _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
Not sure Matt, I have a hard time thinking when Pheonix did not a Low Pressure Sodium fixtures. I think Tucson was first, then Pheonix, then San Diego and the all saved millions of dollars in energy cost, paying for initial cost in a few years. It may very well be it was after you left.
When did the light pollution ordinances in Phoenix begin? As I mentioned,
I lived there in the mid to late '80's. A lot has happened since then, I'm sure.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:28 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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Found this, appears ordinance only covered streetlights and government buildings. i have not been there for about 10 years. I appears they are pushing to have the ordinance thightened When did the light pollution ordinances in Phoenix begin? As I mentioned, I lived there in the mid to late '80's. A lot has happened since then, I'm sure.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:28 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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oops, I make a lot of typing errors and hit send accidentally on this iPad
Here is the link http://www.ajelp.com/comments/light-pollution-in-central-and-southern-arizon... Found this, appears ordinance only covered streetlights and government
buildings. i have not been there for about 10 years. I appears they are pushing to have the ordinance thightened When did the light pollution ordinances in Phoenix begin? As I mentioned,
I lived there in the mid to late '80's. A lot has happened since then, I'm sure.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 1:28 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Matt, I am trying to wrap my head around the idea that a city with light pollution ordinances (Pheonix) has worse skies than a city without them (Salt Lake).
Wow, Phoenix must have made some big changes since I lived there in the mid to late '80's. The light pollution was horrible then. I moved there from Salt Lake and Phoenix was obviously more light polluted. It's good to know that improvements can be made.
Mat
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Erik Hansen Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:49 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Government funded observing platforms
Probably the darker the sky the more difficult road, perhaps some where place by helicopter. At any rate this site does sound like it is not a truly "dark sky", as Ed mentioned. I have always been stricken by how much darker the skies are a 1/2 mile from Pheonix Metro, than they are several miles from Salt Lake. A good demonstration of what proper lighting fixtures can do.
Erik
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
> Patrick, > > There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80. > > This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon. > > Ed > > _______________________________________________ > Utah-Astronomy mailing list > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > > Send messages to the list to > Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com > > The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > > To unsubscribe go to: > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
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This message and any attachments are solely for the use of intended recipients. The information contained herein may include trade secrets, protected health or personal information, privileged or otherwise confidential information. Unauthorized review, forwarding, printing, copying, distributing, or using such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you received this email in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email and any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the message and any attachment from your system. Thank you for your cooperation
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Hi all, When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade. So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete. At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that. BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh. Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe). Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it? It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads. I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see. And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it. I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here? Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight. All in all a really fun day. patrick On 27 Aug 2013, at 09:24, Joe Bauman wrote:
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
Congrats! Hope you found your earphones. And that bulb is just weird. -- Joe ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:35 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Hi all, When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade. So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete. At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that. BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh. Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe). Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it? It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads. I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see. And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it. I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here? Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight. All in all a really fun day. patrick On 27 Aug 2013, at 09:24, Joe Bauman wrote:
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
Did you just hear a shriek? That was me after plugging my DSLR into my computer and finding I'd messed up the settings on the camera yesterday meaning I have no useable pictures from yesterday's outing. Well except for the one of the bulb I took with my iPhone when I got home (thank you Steve Jobs for making the phone more idiot resistant than Nikon's product). So it looks like I'll be retracing yesterday's steps today, starting early afternoon. Should anyone care to come along please let me know and we'll work out the details. Grumble... patrick On 27 Aug 2013, at 23:35, Patrick Wiggins wrote:
Hi all,
When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade.
So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete.
At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that.
BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh.
Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe).
Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg
I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it?
It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads.
I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see.
And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it.
I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here?
Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight.
All in all a really fun day.
patrick
This time it might be a good idea to preview some of your pictures after you have taken them. ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2013 1:14 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Did you just hear a shriek? That was me after plugging my DSLR into my computer and finding I'd messed up the settings on the camera yesterday meaning I have no useable pictures from yesterday's outing. Well except for the one of the bulb I took with my iPhone when I got home (thank you Steve Jobs for making the phone more idiot resistant than Nikon's product). So it looks like I'll be retracing yesterday's steps today, starting early afternoon. Should anyone care to come along please let me know and we'll work out the details. Grumble... patrick On 27 Aug 2013, at 23:35, Patrick Wiggins wrote:
Hi all,
When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade.
So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete.
At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that.
BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh.
Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe).
Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg
I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it?
It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads.
I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see.
And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it.
I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here?
Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight.
All in all a really fun day.
patrick
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
I attempted to visit the arrow near the Bountiful airport on my way home yesterday. It is on a private road that has been gatd off with an 8 to 10 foot high gate. That bulb you found is from the original beacons that inhabited the arrows. it is 1000 watts at 110 volts. They are for sale on eBay if you want to find a value. I'd like to have it if you haven't given it away yet. Brent From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 11:35 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Hi all, When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade. So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete. At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that. BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh. Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe). Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it? It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads. I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see. And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it. I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here? Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight. All in all a really fun day. patrick On 27 Aug 2013, at 09:24, Joe Bauman wrote:
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
Very long day today but I managed to get to all of the sites on my list. And this time I set the camera correctly so I should have pictures online soon. Lakepoint - Now that I know where the arrow over Lakepoint is it was a quick 30 or so minute hike up and back. Exit 77 - Easiest of all. Yesterday I walked from the highway since I was not sure of the road. But I saw it was fine so drove right up to the arrow today. Exit 62 - Biggest challenge of the day. Not having 4 wheel drive I parked at the base and climbed up (I do an hour walk on level ground every day but these more vertical climbs were a chore for my 64 year old body). Still once on top I found it right away. Exit 49 - I searched exactly where GPS said it was (GPS was spot on on all the others) but all I could find was open desert and bits of broken concrete. It appears some sort of pipeline cut right through the area so maybe the folks putting that in broke up the arrow. I'm guessing the arrow no longer exists but will check from the air once my plane gets back. BTW, I did find a couple of metal markers attached to pipes stuck in the found reading "State Highway Right of Way". Bountiful - Back to the one near Bountiful airport that Brent mentioned. I'd hiked in from the trailhead just off the freeway so did not see any gates. But a guy did stop and ask what I was doing. He seemed ok with my being there once I explained so he just drove on. I gave him my card and asked he contact me so I might get permission to bring some CAP cadets to the site and to include his site in the piece I'm working with the reporter on. BTW, funny that he didn't know the arrow was on his land. Stockton - And finally to the arrow above Stockton. That one's in pretty sad shape and nearly totally overgrown. Regarding the bulb, I thought it was a modern one for one of the existing structures. But since Brent suspects it may be from the tower that stood over the arrow I'm first going to do some checking and if it is original see if I can find a museum that wants it. Regarding colors, as I mentioned in an earlier post I only saw color on two of the arrows. But I see that on the map Brent referenced if you click on any given site and then on "NGSLINK More info" some of the sites mention color. An example is the Stockton arrow which refers to "A LARGE, YELLOW, CONCRETE ARROW". patrick On 28 Aug 2013, at 08:17, Brent Watson wrote:
I attempted to visit the arrow near the Bountiful airport on my way home yesterday. It is on a private road that has been gatd off with an 8 to 10 foot high gate.
That bulb you found is from the original beacons that inhabited the arrows. it is 1000 watts at 110 volts. They are for sale on eBay if you want to find a value. I'd like to have it if you haven't given it away yet.
Brent
Quite the mountaineer, Patrick! Congratulations. I'm anxious to see them. -- Joe ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:15 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Very long day today but I managed to get to all of the sites on my list. And this time I set the camera correctly so I should have pictures online soon. Lakepoint - Now that I know where the arrow over Lakepoint is it was a quick 30 or so minute hike up and back. Exit 77 - Easiest of all. Yesterday I walked from the highway since I was not sure of the road. But I saw it was fine so drove right up to the arrow today. Exit 62 - Biggest challenge of the day. Not having 4 wheel drive I parked at the base and climbed up (I do an hour walk on level ground every day but these more vertical climbs were a chore for my 64 year old body). Still once on top I found it right away. Exit 49 - I searched exactly where GPS said it was (GPS was spot on on all the others) but all I could find was open desert and bits of broken concrete. It appears some sort of pipeline cut right through the area so maybe the folks putting that in broke up the arrow. I'm guessing the arrow no longer exists but will check from the air once my plane gets back. BTW, I did find a couple of metal markers attached to pipes stuck in the found reading "State Highway Right of Way". Bountiful - Back to the one near Bountiful airport that Brent mentioned. I'd hiked in from the trailhead just off the freeway so did not see any gates. But a guy did stop and ask what I was doing. He seemed ok with my being there once I explained so he just drove on. I gave him my card and asked he contact me so I might get permission to bring some CAP cadets to the site and to include his site in the piece I'm working with the reporter on. BTW, funny that he didn't know the arrow was on his land. Stockton - And finally to the arrow above Stockton. That one's in pretty sad shape and nearly totally overgrown. Regarding the bulb, I thought it was a modern one for one of the existing structures. But since Brent suspects it may be from the tower that stood over the arrow I'm first going to do some checking and if it is original see if I can find a museum that wants it. Regarding colors, as I mentioned in an earlier post I only saw color on two of the arrows. But I see that on the map Brent referenced if you click on any given site and then on "NGSLINK More info" some of the sites mention color. An example is the Stockton arrow which refers to "A LARGE, YELLOW, CONCRETE ARROW". patrick On 28 Aug 2013, at 08:17, Brent Watson wrote:
I attempted to visit the arrow near the Bountiful airport on my way home yesterday. It is on a private road that has been gatd off with an 8 to 10 foot high gate. That bulb you found is from the original beacons that inhabited the arrows. it is 1000 watts at 110 volts. They are for sale on eBay if you want to find a value. I'd like to have it if you haven't given it away yet. Brent
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
On 29 Aug 2013, at 01:41, Joe Bauman wrote:
Quite the mountaineer, Patrick! Congratulations. I'm anxious to see them. -- Joe
Thanks Joe (though my explorations pale in comparison to yours). No pictures tonight. Too much other to do. Plus I've got an arrow-related meeting this evening that I could report on in the same post where I post the images. patrick p.s. I don't know what I stepped in on my travels but my cat keeps sniffing my shoes, getting all wide eyed and rolling about. I wonder if I wandered through a pot farm...
Finally got several of the pictures posted posted: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/ARROWS.HTML Also I met with some folks at the Civil Air Patrol last evening and they are interested in helping to clean up the area around one or two of the arrows. Clear skies, patrick On 29 Aug 2013, at 01:41, Joe Bauman wrote:
Quite the mountaineer, Patrick! Congratulations. I'm anxious to see them. -- Joe
________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:15 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT)
Very long day today but I managed to get to all of the sites on my list. And this time I set the camera correctly so I should have pictures online soon.
Lakepoint - Now that I know where the arrow over Lakepoint is it was a quick 30 or so minute hike up and back.
Exit 77 - Easiest of all. Yesterday I walked from the highway since I was not sure of the road. But I saw it was fine so drove right up to the arrow today.
Exit 62 - Biggest challenge of the day. Not having 4 wheel drive I parked at the base and climbed up (I do an hour walk on level ground every day but these more vertical climbs were a chore for my 64 year old body). Still once on top I found it right away.
Exit 49 - I searched exactly where GPS said it was (GPS was spot on on all the others) but all I could find was open desert and bits of broken concrete. It appears some sort of pipeline cut right through the area so maybe the folks putting that in broke up the arrow. I'm guessing the arrow no longer exists but will check from the air once my plane gets back.
BTW, I did find a couple of metal markers attached to pipes stuck in the found reading "State Highway Right of Way".
Bountiful - Back to the one near Bountiful airport that Brent mentioned. I'd hiked in from the trailhead just off the freeway so did not see any gates. But a guy did stop and ask what I was doing. He seemed ok with my being there once I explained so he just drove on. I gave him my card and asked he contact me so I might get permission to bring some CAP cadets to the site and to include his site in the piece I'm working with the reporter on. BTW, funny that he didn't know the arrow was on his land.
Stockton - And finally to the arrow above Stockton. That one's in pretty sad shape and nearly totally overgrown.
Regarding the bulb, I thought it was a modern one for one of the existing structures. But since Brent suspects it may be from the tower that stood over the arrow I'm first going to do some checking and if it is original see if I can find a museum that wants it.
Regarding colors, as I mentioned in an earlier post I only saw color on two of the arrows. But I see that on the map Brent referenced if you click on any given site and then on "NGSLINK More info" some of the sites mention color. An example is the Stockton arrow which refers to "A LARGE, YELLOW, CONCRETE ARROW".
patrick
I finally pulled out my July 22, 1943 Salt Lake City sectional aeronautical chart to look at the airway beacon locations. I photographed it and put the photo out in Photobucket. It is a large file in order to preserve detail. You can access it here: http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/n534/brentjwatson/1943SLCSectional.jpg A couple of things stand out. First, there are more lighted beacons than show on the first map I posted. Rotating beacons are shown by a star with an open circle. Flashing beacons are shown by a smaller star that is filled in completely. The locations shown as "x" on the other map seem to correspond to the flashing beacons. 2. The beacon near Grantsville is placed there because there was an airport there. That is the meaning of the circle surrounding the star. That is why it is bypassed on the route arrows. 3. There are two beacon locations near Lakepoint - 61A and 61B. 61B was near Saltair and was the beacon that flashed the Morse Code ID (. - -). Supposedly, the beacons flashed their ID with a separate set of lights to identify them for pilots. They flashed a coded number between 1 and 10, but used the letters W, U, V, H, R, K, D, B, G, or M, representing th numbers from 1 to 10. Beacon 61 would flash Morse code for 1, W which is . - -, the leading digit is omitted. Pilots would remember this sequence by memorizing the mnemonic device When Navigating Very Hard Routes Keep Directions By Good Means. 4. There was a flashing beacon just southwest of Tooele, but no airport is shown at Tooele. Next in line is Stockton, then a flashing beacon a Rush (Valley). 5. There were two beacons east of Salt Lake. One is lower in elevation, and the one I remember watching as a kid is on top of the mountain just north of the mouth of Emigration Canyon. They both flashed the Morse Code "M" for 0. I assume this was for the approach into the Salt Lake City airport. 6. There was also a radio marker beacon (outer marker) at the beacon located at mile marker 62. 7. The Lucin airport is not on the chart. It was not in operation in 1943. 8. There is a railroad going from the Salt Lake Valley to Alta. Those are just a couple of observations. Patrick, if you are going to rejuvenate one of the arrows, why not include the beacon as a part of it. I suggest the Lakepoint arrow. I know where there is a tower with most of the beacon in tact. The state of Montana still maintains theirs and may be a source for parts or information. How cool would it be to see one of these treasures operating nearby! ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, August 30, 2013 4:51 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Finally got several of the pictures posted posted: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/ARROWS.HTML Also I met with some folks at the Civil Air Patrol last evening and they are interested in helping to clean up the area around one or two of the arrows. Clear skies, patrick On 29 Aug 2013, at 01:41, Joe Bauman wrote:
Quite the mountaineer, Patrick! Congratulations. I'm anxious to see them. -- Joe
________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:15 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT)
Very long day today but I managed to get to all of the sites on my list. And this time I set the camera correctly so I should have pictures online soon.
Lakepoint - Now that I know where the arrow over Lakepoint is it was a quick 30 or so minute hike up and back.
Exit 77 - Easiest of all. Yesterday I walked from the highway since I was not sure of the road. But I saw it was fine so drove right up to the arrow today.
Exit 62 - Biggest challenge of the day. Not having 4 wheel drive I parked at the base and climbed up (I do an hour walk on level ground every day but these more vertical climbs were a chore for my 64 year old body). Still once on top I found it right away.
Exit 49 - I searched exactly where GPS said it was (GPS was spot on on all the others) but all I could find was open desert and bits of broken concrete. It appears some sort of pipeline cut right through the area so maybe the folks putting that in broke up the arrow. I'm guessing the arrow no longer exists but will check from the air once my plane gets back.
BTW, I did find a couple of metal markers attached to pipes stuck in the found reading "State Highway Right of Way".
Bountiful - Back to the one near Bountiful airport that Brent mentioned. I'd hiked in from the trailhead just off the freeway so did not see any gates. But a guy did stop and ask what I was doing. He seemed ok with my being there once I explained so he just drove on. I gave him my card and asked he contact me so I might get permission to bring some CAP cadets to the site and to include his site in the piece I'm working with the reporter on. BTW, funny that he didn't know the arrow was on his land.
Stockton - And finally to the arrow above Stockton. That one's in pretty sad shape and nearly totally overgrown.
Regarding the bulb, I thought it was a modern one for one of the existing structures. But since Brent suspects it may be from the tower that stood over the arrow I'm first going to do some checking and if it is original see if I can find a museum that wants it.
Regarding colors, as I mentioned in an earlier post I only saw color on two of the arrows. But I see that on the map Brent referenced if you click on any given site and then on "NGSLINK More info" some of the sites mention color. An example is the Stockton arrow which refers to "A LARGE, YELLOW, CONCRETE ARROW".
patrick
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
Hi Brent, What a nice piece of history. funny how in some ways it's so similar to the sectionals we use today. But how is it that happen to have a sectional that's that old? Is there more of it than what you posted in the JPG? Regarding rejuvenation, that's not my plan. Mainly because of cost. However, the museum in Wendover has that on their list of things to do. So maybe we'll see one working out that way one day. patrick On 30 Aug 2013, at 08:40, Brent Watson wrote:
I finally pulled out my July 22, 1943 Salt Lake City sectional aeronautical chart to look at the airway beacon locations. I photographed it and put the photo out in Photobucket. It is a large file in order to preserve detail. You can access it here:
http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/n534/brentjwatson/1943SLCSectional.jpg
A couple of things stand out. First, there are more lighted beacons than show on the first map I posted. Rotating beacons are shown by a star with an open circle. Flashing beacons are shown by a smaller star that is filled in completely. The locations shown as "x" on the other map seem to correspond to the flashing beacons.
2. The beacon near Grantsville is placed there because there was an airport there. That is the meaning of the circle surrounding the star. That is why it is bypassed on the route arrows.
3. There are two beacon locations near Lakepoint - 61A and 61B. 61B was near Saltair and was the beacon that flashed the Morse Code ID (. - -). Supposedly, the beacons flashed their ID with a separate set of lights to identify them for pilots. They flashed a coded number between 1 and 10, but used the letters W, U, V, H, R, K, D, B, G, or M, representing th numbers from 1 to 10. Beacon 61 would flash Morse code for 1, W which is . - -, the leading digit is omitted. Pilots would remember this sequence by memorizing the mnemonic device When Navigating Very Hard Routes Keep Directions By Good Means.
4. There was a flashing beacon just southwest of Tooele, but no airport is shown at Tooele. Next in line is Stockton, then a flashing beacon a Rush (Valley).
5. There were two beacons east of Salt Lake. One is lower in elevation, and the one I remember watching as a kid is on top of the mountain just north of the mouth of Emigration Canyon. They both flashed the Morse Code "M" for 0. I assume this was for the approach into the Salt Lake City airport.
6. There was also a radio marker beacon (outer marker) at the beacon located at mile marker 62.
7. The Lucin airport is not on the chart. It was not in operation in 1943.
8. There is a railroad going from the Salt Lake Valley to Alta.
Those are just a couple of observations.
Patrick, if you are going to rejuvenate one of the arrows, why not include the beacon as a part of it. I suggest the Lakepoint arrow. I know where there is a tower with most of the beacon in tact. The state of Montana still maintains theirs and may be a source for parts or information. How cool would it be to see one of these treasures operating nearby!
Yes, there is more than what is on the photo. I concentrated on the area we've been talking about and that you have visited. It goes from the UT/NV state line over to Green River and maybe a bit beyond. It pretty well goes from the UT/ID border south to a bit past Fairfield. I got it from my son. He just showed up here one day and gave it to me. It is really enjoyable to study the detail. The old transcontinental rail line is still on the chart as is the line from SLC up Parley's canyon to Park City. I remember watching trains going up that line. So, what are you going to do with your museum quality light bulb? ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2013 4:13 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Hi Brent, What a nice piece of history. funny how in some ways it's so similar to the sectionals we use today. But how is it that happen to have a sectional that's that old? Is there more of it than what you posted in the JPG? Regarding rejuvenation, that's not my plan. Mainly because of cost. However, the museum in Wendover has that on their list of things to do. So maybe we'll see one working out that way one day. patrick On 30 Aug 2013, at 08:40, Brent Watson wrote:
I finally pulled out my July 22, 1943 Salt Lake City sectional aeronautical chart to look at the airway beacon locations. I photographed it and put the photo out in Photobucket. It is a large file in order to preserve detail. You can access it here:
http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/n534/brentjwatson/1943SLCSectional.jpg
Hi Brent, On 31 Aug 2013, at 09:46, Brent Watson wrote:
Yes, there is more than what is on the photo.
Could you bring it to the next SLAS meeting?
So, what are you going to do with your museum quality light bulb?
It's going to the museum in Wendover. Cheers, patrick
Patrick, I am happy to hear that the bulb will be going to a useful place. Hopefully they will get their beacon working. I'll try to remember to bring the sectional to the next meeting - if I remember the meeting! Brent ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2013 4:20 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) Hi Brent, On 31 Aug 2013, at 09:46, Brent Watson wrote:
Yes, there is more than what is on the photo.
Could you bring it to the next SLAS meeting?
So, what are you going to do with your museum quality light bulb?
It's going to the museum in Wendover. Cheers, patrick _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
The 1943 sectional shows an airport at Grantsville. Scrutinizing Google Earth, it looks like it may have been at 40 deg 39 min 42.57 seconds, and 112 deg W 28 min 4.95 sec. It may have had two runways and the above coordinate are the intersection of the two runways. Next time Patrick is flying about, perhaps he could fly over that area and see if anything more is left out there. It might be fun to talk to some old timers at Grantsville and see if they remember anything about it. I did not see an arrow on Google Earth. The old Tooele airport is not charted, but there was a beacon there. Its hard to say, but there may be remnants of an arrow near the runway where the road takes off to the west. It is just north of the road. The airport is not charted, but the old runway and five hangars are still there. The runway has been X'd out for many years now.
On 01 Sep 2013, at 21:52, Brent Watson wrote:
The 1943 sectional shows an airport at Grantsville. Scrutinizing Google Earth, it looks like it may have been at 40 deg 39 min 42.57 seconds, and 112 deg W 28 min 4.95 sec.
That was one of the sites I checked out on foot last week. The information section on the interactive map you referenced last week (http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/ds_mark.prl?PidBox=LP0434) puts it at 40 39 29.43137 112 27 30.62132. All I found there were a couple of open fields. But I still walked about hoping to find some sort of remains but since they are working fields anything that might have been there appears to have been removed and/or plowed under.
Next time Patrick is flying about, perhaps he could fly over that area and see if anything more is left out there.
That is my plan. My plane is gone until tomorrow night so my first chance to get the plane and check the site from the air will be Wednesday if the weather permits. As luck would have it I was sitting in the open door of the jump plane on Friday and we flew very close to the site so I got a good luck but saw nothing. But we were pretty high by then. When I fly over later this week I'll be much lower.
The old Tooele airport is not charted, but there was a beacon there. Its hard to say, but there may be remnants of an arrow near the runway where the road takes off to the west. It is just north of the road. The airport is not charted, but the old runway and five hangars are still there. The runway has been X'd out for many years now.
Alas the hangers are now gone too and the old runway, while still there, ends right at a new large building. Gee it's that airport where I had my first emergency landing... Ah, memories. :) But I digress. The interactive map you posted the other day appears to indicate there was no beacon at the Tooele airport. However the data file the map refers to, http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/ds_mark.prl?PidBox=LP0428, refers to it as Beacon 61B. Zooming in with that map shows an open area near some buildings but no sign of an arrow or tower. However this older map, http://itouchmap.com/latlong.html, seems to show something there. So I'm going to pop down there this week and have a look. patrick (who is having way too much fun spending way too much time on this project)
It's a really interesting piece of history, Patrick, so I don't think you're wasting time on it. -- Joe ________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, September 2, 2013 12:47 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT) On 01 Sep 2013, at 21:52, Brent Watson wrote:
The 1943 sectional shows an airport at Grantsville. Scrutinizing Google Earth, it looks like it may have been at 40 deg 39 min 42.57 seconds, and 112 deg W 28 min 4.95 sec.
That was one of the sites I checked out on foot last week. The information section on the interactive map you referenced last week (http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/ds_mark.prl?PidBox=LP0434) puts it at 40 39 29.43137 112 27 30.62132. All I found there were a couple of open fields. But I still walked about hoping to find some sort of remains but since they are working fields anything that might have been there appears to have been removed and/or plowed under.
Next time Patrick is flying about, perhaps he could fly over that area and see if anything more is left out there.
That is my plan. My plane is gone until tomorrow night so my first chance to get the plane and check the site from the air will be Wednesday if the weather permits. As luck would have it I was sitting in the open door of the jump plane on Friday and we flew very close to the site so I got a good luck but saw nothing. But we were pretty high by then. When I fly over later this week I'll be much lower.
The old Tooele airport is not charted, but there was a beacon there. Its hard to say, but there may be remnants of an arrow near the runway where the road takes off to the west. It is just north of the road. The airport is not charted, but the old runway and five hangars are still there. The runway has been X'd out for many years now.
Alas the hangers are now gone too and the old runway, while still there, ends right at a new large building. Gee it's that airport where I had my first emergency landing... Ah, memories. :) But I digress. The interactive map you posted the other day appears to indicate there was no beacon at the Tooele airport. However the data file the map refers to, http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/cgi-bin/ds_mark.prl?PidBox=LP0428, refers to it as Beacon 61B. Zooming in with that map shows an open area near some buildings but no sign of an arrow or tower. However this older map, http://itouchmap.com/latlong.html, seems to show something there. So I'm going to pop down there this week and have a look. patrick (who is having way too much fun spending way too much time on this project) _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".
Here is an eBay offer to sell one of the lamps Patrick found. Looks like Patrick hit the jackpot! http://www.ebay.com/itm/GE1000W-AIRWAY-BEACON-LAMP-BASE-DOWN-1M-T20BP-120V-N...
And then there is this going for even more: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002CYZ1M4/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&... I can't imagine paying that much for a light bulb. :) patrick On 30 Aug 2013, at 08:47, Brent Watson wrote:
Here is an eBay offer to sell one of the lamps Patrick found. Looks like Patrick hit the jackpot!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GE1000W-AIRWAY-BEACON-LAMP-BASE-DOWN-1M-T20BP-120V-N...
Nice. Man, there is a lot of overgrowth around some of the arrows. I didn’t take any close-up shots except to show how close the arrow is to the cliff, but there was some green paint on the arrow that I photographed. It was hard to tell if it was original or something sprayed on later. It didn’t look like paint that would have been used in that time period, but I don’t know much about paint. Charlotte didn’t go with me. She’s the paint expert. Dave On Aug 30, 2013, at 4:51 AM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> wrote:
Finally got several of the pictures posted posted: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/ARROWS.HTML
Also I met with some folks at the Civil Air Patrol last evening and they are interested in helping to clean up the area around one or two of the arrows.
Clear skies,
patrick
On 29 Aug 2013, at 01:41, Joe Bauman wrote:
Quite the mountaineer, Patrick! Congratulations. I'm anxious to see them. -- Joe
________________________________ From: Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2013 12:15 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Concrete arrows (OT)
Very long day today but I managed to get to all of the sites on my list. And this time I set the camera correctly so I should have pictures online soon.
Lakepoint - Now that I know where the arrow over Lakepoint is it was a quick 30 or so minute hike up and back.
Exit 77 - Easiest of all. Yesterday I walked from the highway since I was not sure of the road. But I saw it was fine so drove right up to the arrow today.
Exit 62 - Biggest challenge of the day. Not having 4 wheel drive I parked at the base and climbed up (I do an hour walk on level ground every day but these more vertical climbs were a chore for my 64 year old body). Still once on top I found it right away.
Exit 49 - I searched exactly where GPS said it was (GPS was spot on on all the others) but all I could find was open desert and bits of broken concrete. It appears some sort of pipeline cut right through the area so maybe the folks putting that in broke up the arrow. I'm guessing the arrow no longer exists but will check from the air once my plane gets back.
BTW, I did find a couple of metal markers attached to pipes stuck in the found reading "State Highway Right of Way".
Bountiful - Back to the one near Bountiful airport that Brent mentioned. I'd hiked in from the trailhead just off the freeway so did not see any gates. But a guy did stop and ask what I was doing. He seemed ok with my being there once I explained so he just drove on. I gave him my card and asked he contact me so I might get permission to bring some CAP cadets to the site and to include his site in the piece I'm working with the reporter on. BTW, funny that he didn't know the arrow was on his land.
Stockton - And finally to the arrow above Stockton. That one's in pretty sad shape and nearly totally overgrown.
Regarding the bulb, I thought it was a modern one for one of the existing structures. But since Brent suspects it may be from the tower that stood over the arrow I'm first going to do some checking and if it is original see if I can find a museum that wants it.
Regarding colors, as I mentioned in an earlier post I only saw color on two of the arrows. But I see that on the map Brent referenced if you click on any given site and then on "NGSLINK More info" some of the sites mention color. An example is the Stockton arrow which refers to "A LARGE, YELLOW, CONCRETE ARROW".
patrick
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Humor aside, if you want to talk 4wd observatory sites the arrows would be down on the list. I gladly share them with friends but not the general public.
Hi all,
When I started the "Government funded observing platforms" thread I intended it to be just a quick bit of humor that history nuts like me might enjoy. Little did I know it would grow instead of quickly fade.
So since folks seem to be enjoying it but realizing it really is off topic I've changed the name of the thread so those not interested can hit delete.
At any rate, using the map Brent supplied I was able to find and photograph three of the arrows today (the ones by Stockton, Lakepoint and by I-80's exit 77). I walked all around where the one just north of Grantsville was supposed to be but there was no sign of it. With luck I'll get to the two a bit further west tomorrow and then the one north of the Bountiful airport after that.
BTW, while searching for the one above Lakepoint I ended up climbing much higher than I needed to. I just could not find it. So I turned around to sit down for a rest only to see the arrow well below me. Augh.
Funny, but while standing on that one I rang Joe to tell him where I was (he's the one that unintentionally got me started on this). And hour or so later he rang me back wanting to make sure I'd made it back down safely (thanks Joe).
Also, while coming down I found this bulb sticking out of the dirt: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/bulb.jpg
I figured it must be burned out and some worker had tossed it. But when I got home I found it still works. Weird. Anyone want it?
It was really neat standing on those things with all my fancy electronics thinking how when the arrows were poured almost 100 years ago the workers doing the pouring could never have imagined things like iPhones and iPads.
I look at these things as a fascinating part of aviation history. So much so that I pitched doing a story about them to a reporter friend. He likes the idea and is thinking sometime next month. We'll see.
And, at the risk of going a bit crazy here, I'd really like to see at least some of these things preserved. I'd start with the one off exit 77 as it's in pretty good shape, already has something of a fence around it and you can drive right up to it.
I'm envisioning getting some CAP cadets out there to clear brush and maybe even apply a coat of the same color paint that was on the arrows originally. I see on the web it's been done elsewhere, so why not here?
Lots of pictures in the camera. Hopefully I'll get a few posted later tonight.
All in all a really fun day.
patrick
On 27 Aug 2013, at 09:24, Joe Bauman wrote:
These things were set up 10 miles apart. Some must remain near roads in nice dark areas. -- Joe
------------------------------ On Tue, Aug 27, 2013 8:22 AM MDT Erik Hansen wrote:
Did not see a road, looks like quite a hike.
Great little platforms for setting up in a dark sky area! Do you think we
could get the government to install electrical outlets and bathrooms for us?
-A
On Mon, Aug 26, 2013 at 3:28 PM, Patrick Wiggins <paw@wirelessbeehive.com>wrote:
Hi Ed,
Thanks for the tip.
I looked on Google Earth at that area but could not find it.
Here's a screen shot of where I was looking: http://users.wirelessbeehive.com/~paw/temp/exit62.jpg
Is that the right area? If it is can you see the arrow and help me narrow the search?
Thanks,
patrick
On 26 Aug 2013, at 07:23, Ed wrote:
Patrick,
There is an aviation arrow for the SLC to San Francisco route on top of the hill just north of exit 62 on I-80.
This is the same spot I mentioned some time back as a good place to get an unobstructed view of the western horizon.
Ed
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participants (7)
-
Brent Watson -
Dave Gary -
Erik Hansen -
Hutchings, Mat -
Joe Bauman -
M Wilson -
Patrick Wiggins