I am an active member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (nicknamed the "Mormon Church") and have been all of my life. I respect other people's point of view event though it is different from mine. By doing so, I believe that explains why some of my closest friends are Catholic, Evangelical Lutheran, Southern Baptist, non-religious, etc. I hope for respect from others for my religious beliefs as I honor theirs. In my opinion, if the "Mormon Church" is to be mentioned in the Astronomy News Group, then perhaps all religions views of Astronomy should be explored equally. I agree with the point of view that we leave the newsgroup to an intelligent discussion of astronomical topics. If religion is brought into the equation, I ask that we all be respectful of each other's point of view and beliefs without criticism or antagonism. Lowell Lyon
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy? Historically, religious groups have always tried to avoid/opress/downplay any scientific discovery that would countermand their belief system or undermine their power base. The Catholic Church, for example, convicted Galileo of heresay, kept him under house arrest and only apologized to him 300+ or so years later. The Bible was written before there was any sort of scientific explanation for the skies and hence contains little to nothing on the subject, so how have religions adopted the new information available into their philosphy? How do they explain its addition when it isn't supported in the Bible/Scriptures? Something like God knew (of course, he'd have to know) but we couldn't understand it so he didn't? I'm not being obnoxious here, I honestly, really don't know. I avoid the whole religious thing, having converted to atheism long, long ago. I can only say that it was very confusing as a child/teen to be taught one thing in school, and something else at home. Something akin to trying to actually believe in Santa Claus when I knew they'd explored the North Pole and never found him. On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Lowell Lyon <bolide@sisna.com> wrote:
I am an active member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (nicknamed the "Mormon Church") and have been all of my life. I respect other people's point of view event though it is different from mine. By doing so, I believe that explains why some of my closest friends are Catholic, Evangelical Lutheran, Southern Baptist, non-religious, etc. I hope for respect from others for my religious beliefs as I honor theirs. In my opinion, if the "Mormon Church" is to be mentioned in the Astronomy News Group, then perhaps all religions views of Astronomy should be explored equally. I agree with the point of view that we leave the newsgroup to an intelligent discussion of astronomical topics. If religion is brought into the equation, I ask that we all be respectful of each other's point of view and beliefs without criticism or antagonism.
Lowell Lyon
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I hesitate to jump into an emotional topic like this, but as a Catholic I just want to say that, yes, the Catholic Church does have a very serious interest in astronomy, and all other sciences. The Vatican owns and operates a first-rate, modern observatory at Castel Gandolfo, north of Rome, and conducts a range of astronomical studies there. Basically, the Catholic Church's position on creation is: the bible tells us that God made the universe, and all that is in it, and the sciences are working hard to tell us how He did it. For anyone who is interested in a more enlightened description of the Vatican's history of astronomical studies, their observatory, and views about science, I highly recommend a beautiful new book "The Heavens Proclaim: Astronomy and the Vatican" by Guy Consolmagno, S.J. Clear skies, Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Clyde" <jchorley@gmail.com> To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy? Historically, religious groups have always tried to avoid/opress/downplay any scientific discovery that would countermand their belief system or undermine their power base. The Catholic Church, for example, convicted Galileo of heresay, kept him under house arrest and only apologized to him 300+ or so years later.
The Bible was written before there was any sort of scientific explanation for the skies and hence contains little to nothing on the subject, so how have religions adopted the new information available into their philosphy? How do they explain its addition when it isn't supported in the Bible/Scriptures? Something like God knew (of course, he'd have to know) but we couldn't understand it so he didn't? I'm not being obnoxious here, I honestly, really don't know. I avoid the whole religious thing, having converted to atheism long, long ago.
I can only say that it was very confusing as a child/teen to be taught one thing in school, and something else at home. Something akin to trying to actually believe in Santa Claus when I knew they'd explored the North Pole and never found him.
On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Lowell Lyon <bolide@sisna.com> wrote:
I am an active member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (nicknamed the "Mormon Church") and have been all of my life. I respect other people's point of view event though it is different from mine. By doing so, I believe that explains why some of my closest friends are Catholic, Evangelical Lutheran, Southern Baptist, non-religious, etc. I hope for respect from others for my religious beliefs as I honor theirs. In my opinion, if the "Mormon Church" is to be mentioned in the Astronomy News Group, then perhaps all religions views of Astronomy should be explored equally. I agree with the point of view that we leave the newsgroup to an intelligent discussion of astronomical topics. If religion is brought into the equation, I ask that we all be respectful of each other's point of view and beliefs without criticism or antagonism.
Lowell Lyon
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Ken,
Your comment is exactly how conflicts with science and religion were handled in my education. The heart of the problem is that many claim they are writing the will and words of God and absolute truth. If what they write is proven wrong then it is hard to still maintain it is the word of God. I guess this is why, in the past, people would be put to death for presenting scientific discoveries. Also, the reason many want biblical thoughts on creation taught in the public classroom today. Erik I hesitate to jump into an emotional topic like this, but as a Catholic I
just want to say that, yes, the Catholic Church does have a very serious interest in astronomy, and all other sciences. The Vatican owns and operates a first-rate, modern observatory at Castel Gandolfo, north of Rome, and conducts a range of astronomical studies there. Basically, the Catholic Church's position on creation is: the bible tells us that God made the universe, and all that is in it, and the sciences are working hard to tell us how He did it. For anyone who is interested in a more enlightened description of the Vatican's history of astronomical studies, their observatory, and views about science, I highly recommend a beautiful new book "The Heavens Proclaim: Astronomy and the Vatican" by Guy Consolmagno, S.J.
Clear skies, Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Clyde" <jchorley@gmail.com> To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy? Historically, religious groups have always tried to avoid/opress/downplay any scientific discovery that would countermand their belief system or undermine their power base. The Catholic Church, for example, convicted Galileo of heresay, kept him under house arrest and only apologized to him 300+ or so years later.
The Bible was written before there was any sort of scientific explanation for the skies and hence contains little to nothing on the subject, so how have religions adopted the new information available into their philosphy? How do they explain its addition when it isn't supported in the Bible/Scriptures? Something like God knew (of course, he'd have to know) but we couldn't understand it so he didn't? I'm not being obnoxious here, I honestly, really don't know. I avoid the whole religious thing, having converted to atheism long, long ago.
I can only say that it was very confusing as a child/teen to be taught one thing in school, and something else at home. Something akin to trying to actually believe in Santa Claus when I knew they'd explored the North Pole and never found him.
On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Lowell Lyon <bolide@sisna.com> wrote:
I am an active member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (nicknamed the "Mormon Church") and have been all of my life. I respect other people's point of view event though it is different from mine. By doing so, I believe that explains why some of my closest friends are Catholic, Evangelical Lutheran, Southern Baptist, non-religious, etc. I hope for respect from others for my religious beliefs as I honor theirs. In my opinion, if the "Mormon Church" is to be mentioned in the Astronomy News Group, then perhaps all religions views of Astronomy should be explored equally. I agree with the point of view that we leave the newsgroup to an intelligent discussion of astronomical topics. If religion is brought into the equation, I ask that we all be respectful of each other's point of view and beliefs without criticism or antagonism.
Lowell Lyon
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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It's also interesting to note that the Bible was basically handed down as oral tradition until about the time of the Jewish Babylonian Captivity. While in Babylon, the rabis and scribes began to make a serious effort to write these stories down, (there are Biblical scholars who doubt that Moses wrote the Pentatuch or first five books of the Old Testament) thus forming the beginnings o the Old Testament. It's also interesting to look at many of the passages in Genesis and find the Creation and Great Flood stories have conflicting statements, known as doublets. Much of the first part of the Bible was written long after the initial events and, as such, has suffered from changes in the oral stories that they are based on. --- On Tue, 12/14/10, erikhansen@thebluezone.net <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote: From: erikhansen@thebluezone.net <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Tuesday, December 14, 2010, 10:51 AM
Ken,
Your comment is exactly how conflicts with science and religion were handled in my education. The heart of the problem is that many claim they are writing the will and words of God and absolute truth. If what they write is proven wrong then it is hard to still maintain it is the word of God. I guess this is why, in the past, people would be put to death for presenting scientific discoveries. Also, the reason many want biblical thoughts on creation taught in the public classroom today. Erik I hesitate to jump into an emotional topic like this, but as a Catholic I
just want to say that, yes, the Catholic Church does have a very serious interest in astronomy, and all other sciences. The Vatican owns and operates a first-rate, modern observatory at Castel Gandolfo, north of Rome, and conducts a range of astronomical studies there. Basically, the Catholic Church's position on creation is: the bible tells us that God made the universe, and all that is in it, and the sciences are working hard to tell us how He did it. For anyone who is interested in a more enlightened description of the Vatican's history of astronomical studies, their observatory, and views about science, I highly recommend a beautiful new book "The Heavens Proclaim: Astronomy and the Vatican" by Guy Consolmagno, S.J.
Clear skies, Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Clyde" <jchorley@gmail.com> To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy? Historically, religious groups have always tried to avoid/opress/downplay any scientific discovery that would countermand their belief system or undermine their power base. The Catholic Church, for example, convicted Galileo of heresay, kept him under house arrest and only apologized to him 300+ or so years later.
The Bible was written before there was any sort of scientific explanation for the skies and hence contains little to nothing on the subject, so how have religions adopted the new information available into their philosphy? How do they explain its addition when it isn't supported in the Bible/Scriptures? Something like God knew (of course, he'd have to know) but we couldn't understand it so he didn't? I'm not being obnoxious here, I honestly, really don't know. I avoid the whole religious thing, having converted to atheism long, long ago.
I can only say that it was very confusing as a child/teen to be taught one thing in school, and something else at home. Something akin to trying to actually believe in Santa Claus when I knew they'd explored the North Pole and never found him.
On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Lowell Lyon <bolide@sisna.com> wrote:
I am an active member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (nicknamed the "Mormon Church") and have been all of my life. I respect other people's point of view event though it is different from mine. By doing so, I believe that explains why some of my closest friends are Catholic, Evangelical Lutheran, Southern Baptist, non-religious, etc. I hope for respect from others for my religious beliefs as I honor theirs. In my opinion, if the "Mormon Church" is to be mentioned in the Astronomy News Group, then perhaps all religions views of Astronomy should be explored equally. I agree with the point of view that we leave the newsgroup to an intelligent discussion of astronomical topics. If religion is brought into the equation, I ask that we all be respectful of each other's point of view and beliefs without criticism or antagonism.
Lowell Lyon
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Exactly right Ken. The modern Catholic Church's beliefs are very much in line with current science and in fact have made significant contributions to it. Most protestant sects don't have an official position but simply defer to current science. There are some exceptions in some evangelical churches for example but typically they are not official positions just member positions. For the vast majority of sects they simply follow the current scientific positions. I know much is made of the few exception, controversy sells newspapers, magazines and gains viewers and web hits. We get into trouble when we think Religion is explaining a scientific concept, it's not. The Bible is not a book of science, it is a book of faith, history and insight, these are things that ancients thought were important to remember not necessarily as fact but as lessons and allegory. Religion explains why, Science explains how. We should always be extremely careful when we overlay scientific beliefs over religion or visa versa, it is big mistake and doesn't work. The two disciplines are answering different questions. I know people try to use science to prove religious beliefs in an attempt to gain some type of legitimacy but it will almost always prove fruitless, or worse, counterproductive. Let's stick to astronomy on this board and leave religious topics where it belongs, in church. Bob -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Ken Harris Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 10:40 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy I hesitate to jump into an emotional topic like this, but as a Catholic I just want to say that, yes, the Catholic Church does have a very serious interest in astronomy, and all other sciences. The Vatican owns and operates a first-rate, modern observatory at Castel Gandolfo, north of Rome, and conducts a range of astronomical studies there. Basically, the Catholic Church's position on creation is: the bible tells us that God made the universe, and all that is in it, and the sciences are working hard to tell us how He did it. For anyone who is interested in a more enlightened description of the Vatican's history of astronomical studies, their observatory, and views about science, I highly recommend a beautiful new book "The Heavens Proclaim: Astronomy and the Vatican" by Guy Consolmagno, S.J. Clear skies, Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Clyde" <jchorley@gmail.com> To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy?
If I'm not mistaken it was a Belgian Catholic Priest/Scholar, Monsignor Georges Lemaître, who first came up with the Big Bang Theory as a proof that God exists. His reasoning was that only a Supreme Intelligence (ie God) could bring about the creation as we know it. If just blows my mind that today the Big Bang Theory is highly regarded by the scientific establishment and dismissed by the religious community. Speak about turning things up-side-down! --- On Tue, 12/14/10, Ken Harris <kharrismar@earthlink.net> wrote: From: Ken Harris <kharrismar@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Tuesday, December 14, 2010, 10:39 AM I hesitate to jump into an emotional topic like this, but as a Catholic I just want to say that, yes, the Catholic Church does have a very serious interest in astronomy, and all other sciences. The Vatican owns and operates a first-rate, modern observatory at Castel Gandolfo, north of Rome, and conducts a range of astronomical studies there. Basically, the Catholic Church's position on creation is: the bible tells us that God made the universe, and all that is in it, and the sciences are working hard to tell us how He did it. For anyone who is interested in a more enlightened description of the Vatican's history of astronomical studies, their observatory, and views about science, I highly recommend a beautiful new book "The Heavens Proclaim: Astronomy and the Vatican" by Guy Consolmagno, S.J. Clear skies, Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Clyde" <jchorley@gmail.com> To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Mormon Astronomy
Do any religions actually have an official viewpoint on astronomy? Historically, religious groups have always tried to avoid/opress/downplay any scientific discovery that would countermand their belief system or undermine their power base. The Catholic Church, for example, convicted Galileo of heresay, kept him under house arrest and only apologized to him 300+ or so years later.
The Bible was written before there was any sort of scientific explanation for the skies and hence contains little to nothing on the subject, so how have religions adopted the new information available into their philosphy? How do they explain its addition when it isn't supported in the Bible/Scriptures? Something like God knew (of course, he'd have to know) but we couldn't understand it so he didn't? I'm not being obnoxious here, I honestly, really don't know. I avoid the whole religious thing, having converted to atheism long, long ago.
I can only say that it was very confusing as a child/teen to be taught one thing in school, and something else at home. Something akin to trying to actually believe in Santa Claus when I knew they'd explored the North Pole and never found him.
participants (6)
-
erikhansen＠thebluezone.net -
Julie Clyde -
Ken Harris -
Lowell Lyon -
M Wilson -
Robert Taylor