Joe, I do not know about livestock, but all the underground piping at the plant is plastic of some kind because of the impressed currents. 73 On 10/23/2012 6:09 PM, Joe Bauman wrote:

At one time locals filed a federal suit against IPP alleging that they were using the ground to conduct electricity -- I don't understand why that was, but it might have had some connection with the AC/DC conversion. Supposedly it was harming the livestock.

Very nice Don! Mat -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Don J. Colton Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 12:53 PM To: 'Utah Astronomy' Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] New Images Some new images I took at Kanab September 2012 (except the Rosette taken in 2011 and reprocessed). Western Veil Nebula http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5441&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Rosette Nebula NGC 2237 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5444&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Christmas Tree NGC 2264 and the Cone Nebula - you may want to download and rotate counterclockwise to see the Christmas Tree better http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5447&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 M17 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5450&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 NGC 1983 (star cluster) and IC 410 (nebulosity) http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5453&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Clear Skies, Don Colton _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options". This message and any attachments are solely for the use of intended recipients. The information contained herein may include trade secrets, protected health or personal information, privileged or otherwise confidential information. Unauthorized review, forwarding, printing, copying, distributing, or using such information is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you received this email in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying of this email and any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the message and any attachment from your system. Thank you for your cooperation

Don, those images are all superb!  It's wonderful to have so many outstanding astro-photographers here in Utah. ________________________________ From: Don J. Colton <djcolton@piol.com> To: 'Utah Astronomy' <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, November 2, 2012 10:52 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] New Images Some new images I took at Kanab September 2012 (except the Rosette taken in 2011 and reprocessed). Western Veil Nebula http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5441&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Rosette Nebula NGC 2237 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5444&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Christmas Tree NGC 2264 and the Cone Nebula - you may want to download and rotate counterclockwise to see the Christmas Tree better http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5447&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 M17 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5450&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 NGC 1983 (star cluster) and IC 410 (nebulosity) http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5453&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Clear Skies, Don Colton _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

Thanks for all the kind comments. I used a Takahashi TOA 150 scope with f/7.2 field flattener and a QSI 583 monochrome camera with LRGB filters for all but the Rosette. It was taken with a Takahashi FSQ106ED with f/3.8 reducer with the same camera. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Brent Watson Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 11:45 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] New Images Don, Those are very nice!  What equipment did you use? ________________________________ From: Don J. Colton <djcolton@piol.com> To: 'Utah Astronomy' <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, November 2, 2012 10:52 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] New Images Some new images I took at Kanab September 2012 (except the Rosette taken in 2011 and reprocessed). Western Veil Nebula http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5441&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Rosette Nebula NGC 2237 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5444&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Christmas Tree NGC 2264 and the Cone Nebula - you may want to download and rotate counterclockwise to see the Christmas Tree better http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5447&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 M17 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5450&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 NGC 1983 (star cluster) and IC 410 (nebulosity) http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5453&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Clear Skies, Don Colton _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options". _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

________________________________ From: Dave Gary <davegary@me.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, November 2, 2012 4:14 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] New Images Wow, Don. I need lessons. Sent from my iPad On Nov 2, 2012, at 10:52 AM, "Don J. Colton" <djcolton@piol.com> wrote:

Some new images I took at Kanab September 2012 (except the Rosette taken in 2011 and reprocessed).

Western Veil Nebula http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5441&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

Rosette Nebula NGC 2237 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5444&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

Christmas Tree NGC 2264 and the Cone Nebula - you may want to download and rotate counterclockwise to see the Christmas Tree better http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5447&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

M17 http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5450&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

NGC 1983 (star cluster) and IC 410 (nebulosity) http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5453&g2_imageViewsIndex=1

Clear Skies,

Don Colton

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_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

The trick is to get high voltage for transmission and low voltage for users.  Back in Edison's and Tesla's time the conversion from low voltage to high voltage and back for a DC system could not be accomplished easily like we do today.  It is easy to convert AC voltages - you use a transformer.  DC voltage changes require more sophisticated electronics.  Edison could not convert the DC voltage and so had to use low voltage generators.  Low voltage has significantly more loss than high voltage. Loss is inversely proportional to the square of the voltage, and is independent of whether the voltage is AC or DC. That's why Edison's system could not go long distances.  Tesla and Westinghouse had the advantage of easy voltage conversion. High voltage DC systems require smaller, simpler conductors than AC systems because of skin effect.  The transmission line cost is lower.  That is the reason DC is sometimes used for long distance power transmission. Nicola Tesla - surely an unrewarded super-genius.  We need someone like that today. BTW, the telephone company does use the earth for a return path for the bell signal.  It turns out that the earth really has a pretty low resistance.  If the power company is getting "ground" currents, I suspect a fault in the transmission line. Brent ________________________________ From: Larry Holmes <larry@kijoda.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 5:53 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Science Friday: Tesla Interesting point when comparing Tesla's DC system with Edison's DC.  You out there may or may not know that the Intermountain Power Plant in Delta, UT generates AC but converts it to DC for transmission to Riverside. CA where a 2nd converter station restores it to AC.  The line is, I believe, some 700+ miles long, and they experience less loss with DC than AC.  Must have been quite sizable to pay for the 2 converter stations, but a drop in the bucket when compared to the total cost of the plant.  So, we burn Utah coal, to furnish electricity to CA,  because LA Water & Power could not get a permit to build a coal-fired station in CA.  The Delta station is owned by a consortium of CA cities to which the electricity is distributed.  This really does not have anything to do with astronomy (for which I apologize), but does tie in with the Oatmeal discussion of the two men.  The author could use a little soap in his mouth.  Anyone remember that one?  I %%#@#&** sure do.  73 On 10/22/2012 6:14 PM, Wiggins Patrick wrote:

I just finished listening to a podcast of last Friday's edition of Science Friday.  The subject was Nikola Tesla.  In case you heard the piece and wondered about the Tesla cartoon they referred to, here it is:

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/tesla

Caution, there are a few spots where the language is PG-13.

And here is the podcast.

patrick

Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________

_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

Inman's quite a character. I've been reading The Oatmeal for several years now (I have his first book as well). In the last year or so his comics have really taken off, and have been copied by another website called funnyjunk.com. Matt politely asked them to stop re-posting his comics without permission, and dropped the matter. About a year later, he received a letter threatening to sue for $20,000 from funnyjunk.com's lawyer for defamation. As is Inman's style, instead of paying up, he said he would raise $20k, take a picture of it, create a picture of funnyjunk.com's mom seducing a Kodiak bear, and send it along to the lawyer. Oh, and donate the money raised to the National Wildlife Foundation and the American Cancer Society. And it just spiraled from there with more hilarity. You can read about all the shenanigans on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Oatmeal_and_FunnyJunk_legal_dispute I'm not linking to The Oatmeal's pages on the lawsuit, there's lots of NSFW stuff on there--if you want to see it, you can find it easily enough. Dan On Oct 23, 2012, at 8:35 PM, daniel turner <outwest112@yahoo.com> wrote:

Ever drive under a high power line with your radio turned on? AC power lines act like radio transmitters. The power just drifts off into the air. A friend of mine in the radio industry says that the power loss of long distances is significant. DC transmission gets around this.

DT

________________________________ From: Brent Watson <brentjwatson@yahoo.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 6:28 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Science Friday: Tesla

The trick is to get high voltage for transmission and low voltage for users. Back in Edison's and Tesla's time the conversion from low voltage to high voltage and back for a DC system could not be accomplished easily like we do today. It is easy to convert AC voltages - you use a transformer. DC voltage changes require more sophisticated electronics. Edison could not convert the DC voltage and so had to use low voltage generators. Low voltage has significantly more loss than high voltage. Loss is inversely proportional to the square of the voltage, and is independent of whether the voltage is AC or DC. That's why Edison's system could not go long distances. Tesla and Westinghouse had the advantage of easy voltage conversion.

High voltage DC systems require smaller, simpler conductors than AC systems because of skin effect. The transmission line cost is lower. That is the reason DC is sometimes used for long distance power transmission.

Nicola Tesla - surely an unrewarded super-genius. We need someone like that today.

BTW, the telephone company does use the earth for a return path for the bell signal. It turns out that the earth really has a pretty low resistance. If the power company is getting "ground" currents, I suspect a fault in the transmission line.

Brent

________________________________ From: Larry Holmes <larry@kijoda.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 5:53 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Science Friday: Tesla

Interesting point when comparing Tesla's DC system with Edison's DC. You out there may or may not know that the Intermountain Power Plant in Delta, UT generates AC but converts it to DC for transmission to Riverside. CA where a 2nd converter station restores it to AC. The line is, I believe, some 700+ miles long, and they experience less loss with DC than AC. Must have been quite sizable to pay for the 2 converter stations, but a drop in the bucket when compared to the total cost of the plant. So, we burn Utah coal, to furnish electricity to CA, because LA Water & Power could not get a permit to build a coal-fired station in CA. The Delta station is owned by a consortium of CA cities to which the electricity is distributed. This really does not have anything to do with astronomy (for which I apologize), but does tie in with the Oatmeal discussion of the two men. The author could use a little soap in his mouth. Anyone remember that one? I %%#@#&** sure do. 73

On 10/22/2012 6:14 PM, Wiggins Patrick wrote:

...

I just finished listening to a podcast of last Friday's edition of Science Friday. The subject was Nikola Tesla. In case you heard the piece and wondered about the Tesla cartoon they referred to, here it is:

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/tesla

Caution, there are a few spots where the language is PG-13.

And here is the podcast.

patrick

Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________

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-- Daniel Holmes, danielh@holmesonics.com "Laugh while you can, monkey boy!" -- Lord John Whorfin