I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment. Debbie
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Joe, Why the huge difference in quality? It seems to me if one pays $2000 for a CCD camera you should be able to get some high quality images, color or mono. If you are shooting star clusters and galaxies, would there be much of a diiference? Maybe there would be with the Veil Nebula and other nebulae. I'm going to have to research this a little more. Debbie On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
That's a really good question, Debbie. The other day there was a discussion about that on the SBIG newsgroup I belong to. I'm not qualified to give a good answer, except that great astroimagers want to take views with filters. For one thing, they normally use color filters and clear exposures, and many often add in the H-alpha filter. There must be a drop in resolution if one exposure is made for color, compared with four exposures through filters on the same size chip. But I suspect the practical answer depends in part on what telescope and mount is used -- that is, whether this is photography at the high end of astroimaging. If not, it might be fine to use the color version; probably the results would be better than I can get with my filters, because my camera has a small chip. I would love to see side-by-side comparisons of the same subject taken with the two different cameras. Another important consideration is guiding. You have to be spot on with each subexposure, and in the SBIG group a 12-minute subexposure is considered short, with 20 minutes more like it (I learned that today). Some of those guys shoot 10 hours or more cumulatively, over several nights, with 30-minute subs. Wish I could be more helpful -- Joe --- On Tue, 12/14/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Tuesday, December 14, 2010, 12:43 PM Joe,
Why the huge difference in quality? It seems to me if one pays $2000 for a CCD camera you should be able to get some high quality images, color or mono. If you are shooting star clusters and galaxies, would there be much of a diiference? Maybe there would be with the Veil Nebula and other nebulae. I'm going to have to research this a little more.
Debbie
On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM > I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Here are a few pictures from last night. The moon images were captured with a webcam. Moon, http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=4034&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Geminid and Orion, http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=4037&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 Enjoy! David Rankin
Nice! --- On Tue, 12/14/10, David Rankin <David@rankinstudio.com> wrote:
From: David Rankin <David@rankinstudio.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Some Pictures, Moon, Geminid Meteor. To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Tuesday, December 14, 2010, 1:34 PM Here are a few pictures from last night. The moon images were captured with a webcam.
Moon,
http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=4034&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
Geminid and Orion,
http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=4037&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
Enjoy!
David Rankin
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Debbie, See http://www.sbig.com/FAQ/General/Should_I_buy_a_Color_CCD_or_Monochrome_CCD_. htm. This is a simple explanation of color vs. mono by the Company that makes both. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Debbie Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 12:43 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips Joe, Why the huge difference in quality? It seems to me if one pays $2000 for a CCD camera you should be able to get some high quality images, color or mono. If you are shooting star clusters and galaxies, would there be much of a diiference? Maybe there would be with the Veil Nebula and other nebulae. I'm going to have to research this a little more. Debbie On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
I found this yesterday while on the cloudynights forums. Scroll down and view the video on the right of the webpage. Amazing color images! http://www.johnrcrilly.com/LX200-14/ Now I'm leaning towards a monochrome camera. Don, is your camera monochrome or color? Debbie On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 1:22 PM, Don J. Colton <djcolton@piol.com> wrote:
Debbie,
See
http://www.sbig.com/FAQ/General/Should_I_buy_a_Color_CCD_or_Monochrome_CCD_. htm. This is a simple explanation of color vs. mono by the Company that makes both.
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Debbie Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 12:43 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips
Joe,
Why the huge difference in quality? It seems to me if one pays $2000 for a CCD camera you should be able to get some high quality images, color or mono. If you are shooting star clusters and galaxies, would there be much of a diiference? Maybe there would be with the Veil Nebula and other nebulae. I'm going to have to research this a little more.
Debbie
On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com
wrote:
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Debbie, I have both kinds of cameras but my best images have been with the monochrome. My tracking has improved but look at my gallery and you can compare single shot color images with a Starlight Xpress SXVF-H9C camera and images with my monochrome QSI-583 with 3 color filters (last three pages of my gallery starting with M31). See: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=289 Don -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Debbie Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2010 12:58 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips I found this yesterday while on the cloudynights forums. Scroll down and view the video on the right of the webpage. Amazing color images! http://www.johnrcrilly.com/LX200-14/ Now I'm leaning towards a monochrome camera. Don, is your camera monochrome or color? Debbie On Tue, Dec 14, 2010 at 1:22 PM, Don J. Colton <djcolton@piol.com> wrote:
Debbie,
See
http://www.sbig.com/FAQ/General/Should_I_buy_a_Color_CCD_or_Monochrome_CCD_.
htm. This is a simple explanation of color vs. mono by the Company that makes both.
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Debbie Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 12:43 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips
Joe,
Why the huge difference in quality? It seems to me if one pays $2000 for a CCD camera you should be able to get some high quality images, color or mono. If you are shooting star clusters and galaxies, would there be much of a diiference? Maybe there would be with the Veil Nebula and other nebulae. I'm going to have to research this a little more.
Debbie
On Sun, Dec 12, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com
wrote:
Hi Debbie, That question is much more complicated than one might think. I've learned a lot about imagers since I joined the SBIG users group. One consideration is to match the camera's pixel size with the focal length of the telescope. SBIG offers two of the 8300 cameras, at the same price: color and mono. Almost all the imagers want the mono version, as counter-intuitive as that is. The reason is that the color version has a color chip, which gives color with one exposure but isn't as sharp as using filters. The mono version has no filters, which you have to buy separately, along with a filter wheel -- a pretty expensive proposition, on top of the $1,995 for the camera. The mono version takes color pics by making exposures through the red, green and blue filters, which you then combine with software. (Most folks also take a luminosity exposure too at the same time.) The best thing is to learn, learn, learn before you get locked into any system. My feeling is it's a good idea to call OPT and talk with one of the experts, just go over all the questions you might have and ask for a recommendation. From my own experience -- and granted, this was years ago -- they will steer you in the right direction even if you intend to buy there and the recommendation leads you to choose something less expensive. -- Best wishes, Joe --- On Sun, 12/12/10, Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> wrote:
From: Debbie <astrodeb@beyondbb.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 8300 Kodak chips To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, December 12, 2010, 10:43 AM I noticed on OPT's website that there are a couple of different cameras that have the full-frame 8300 Kodak chips. Should a novice imager go with ATIK, SBIG, or Orion's Parsec camera? I would appreciate some opinions from experienced imagers. I'm just gathering information at the moment.
Debbie _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
participants (4)
-
David Rankin -
Debbie -
Don J. Colton -
Joe Bauman