I just got off the phone with Brian Greer of Protostar. Protostar is one of three businesses that Brian runs and it's not the one that puts groceries on the table. He answered on the first ring and told me about the business issues he had last year. He says that now he is again taking orders and plans to have his backlog worked off soon. I ordered online back in July when his wait time was 16 weeks and now he's taking orders for 6 weeks out. Having bought telescope and ATM equipment over the years from the likes of Discovery, Novak, and Coulter, I learned patience long ago. I understand that this is really just a hoby and it's supposed to be fun for all concerned, even suppliers like Brian. DT
Unfortunately, I have read of too many believable people who sent Brian money and were promised product or astro items, only to wait way past the expected and promised time of delivery. Then to be completely ignored. Many unanswered emails, unanswered phone calls and virtually no communication at all. I have not heard of anyone being out money as he has refunded money to each and everyone I personally heard from. I think there are one or two of them here on this list. Hobby or not when I send someone money and get a promise I expect it to be kept or at least a phone call to explain why it is not. Just my views, yours may vary. Steve
Date: Fri, 4 Nov 2011 08:20:39 -0700 From: outwest112@yahoo.com To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Protostar update
I just got off the phone with Brian Greer of Protostar. Protostar is one of three businesses that Brian runs and it's not the one that puts groceries on the table. He answered on the first ring and told me about the business issues he had last year. He says that now he is again taking orders and plans to have his backlog worked off soon. I ordered online back in July when his wait time was 16 weeks and now he's taking orders for 6 weeks out.
Having bought telescope and ATM equipment over the years from the likes of Discovery, Novak, and Coulter, I learned patience long ago. I understand that this is really just a hoby and it's supposed to be fun for all concerned, even suppliers like Brian.
DT _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
On 11/4/11, Steve Fisher <iotacass1@hotmail.com> wrote:
Unfortunately, I have read of too many believable people who sent Brian money and were promised product or astro items, only to wait way past the expected and promised time of delivery. Then to be completely ignored.
Steve hit the nail on the head. Long lead times by themselves are not the issue with Protostar at all, despite the gist of Daniel's post. Many astro-companies, some having been in business for decades, still enjoy stellar reputations and glowing customer feedback. The key is honesty, good customer communications, and not making promises they don't keep. My own experience with Bryan is somewhat disheartening, especially because a good pre-customer status relationship may have been ruined because of Protostar business practices. We had spoken with each other extensively back when Bryan's S&T article was published at around the same time as my first one, about a dozen years ago. BTW, it's still excellent reading and good advice for reflector owners. Bryan demonstrated that cooling a mirror to ambient temperature by blowing on the back side is not nearly as effective as removing the boundary layer of warm air near the mirror surface. Alan Adler and Bill Kelley both embraced this idea, though it still has not caught-on with ATM's. I am incorporating the concept in my 17.5" Newt. A fast-moving air stream near the mirror's face does NOT degrade seeing, somewhat counterintuitively. Bryan's work was top-notch and indisputable. But I digress. A customer can only hear "It's shipping this Friday" for so many months, before they stop believing. Protostar's problem was clearly one of misleading customers. I'm not saying it was intentional, but if you tell a customer "it's in the mail", it really should be. I'd rather have been told "we're still behind, sorry about this, but it's going to be a few more weeks." Further, Bryan took unilateral action based on posts on Cloudy Nights about a year ago, when customers were sharing their stories in a public forum. If anyone is interested in further details of my personal story, I'd be glad to tell you off-list. Caveat Emptor is still the rule of the day.
Reminds me when I helped someone sell astro gear who had no e-mail. The individual accepted and cashed payment only to neglect to send astro gear he had sold (about $3,000 worth) . I received a months worth of phone calls threatening me with FBI involvement, while my "friend" was free of any harassment.
Once you accept money you have a higher obligation, hobby or not. On 11/4/11, Steve Fisher <iotacass1@hotmail.com> wrote:
Unfortunately, I have read of too many believable people who sent Brian money and were promised product or astro items, only to wait way past the expected and promised time of delivery. Then to be completely ignored.
Steve hit the nail on the head.
Long lead times by themselves are not the issue with Protostar at all, despite the gist of Daniel's post.
Many astro-companies, some having been in business for decades, still enjoy stellar reputations and glowing customer feedback. The key is honesty, good customer communications, and not making promises they don't keep.
My own experience with Bryan is somewhat disheartening, especially because a good pre-customer status relationship may have been ruined because of Protostar business practices. We had spoken with each other extensively back when Bryan's S&T article was published at around the same time as my first one, about a dozen years ago.
BTW, it's still excellent reading and good advice for reflector owners. Bryan demonstrated that cooling a mirror to ambient temperature by blowing on the back side is not nearly as effective as removing the boundary layer of warm air near the mirror surface. Alan Adler and Bill Kelley both embraced this idea, though it still has not caught-on with ATM's. I am incorporating the concept in my 17.5" Newt. A fast-moving air stream near the mirror's face does NOT degrade seeing, somewhat counterintuitively. Bryan's work was top-notch and indisputable.
But I digress.
A customer can only hear "It's shipping this Friday" for so many months, before they stop believing. Protostar's problem was clearly one of misleading customers. I'm not saying it was intentional, but if you tell a customer "it's in the mail", it really should be. I'd rather have been told "we're still behind, sorry about this, but it's going to be a few more weeks."
Further, Bryan took unilateral action based on posts on Cloudy Nights about a year ago, when customers were sharing their stories in a public forum.
If anyone is interested in further details of my personal story, I'd be glad to tell you off-list.
Caveat Emptor is still the rule of the day.
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Long lead times are de rigeur in this hobby. By themselves, they aren't usually deal-breakers. Customers just want to be told the truth. Look at companies like D&G, Astro-Physics, even Parallax. While all of them have had or still have very long lead times on certain products, they have extremely satisfied customers because their communication is honest and up-front. None promise an imminent ship date only to delay for months after hanging-up the phone. A little honesty goes a LONG way. It makes all the difference in the world, even in the face of long lead times.
participants (4)
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Chuck Hards -
daniel turner -
erikhansen＠thebluezone.net -
Steve Fisher