Don't forget the value added tax, in Denmark taxes double the price of a car. My cousin drives a Morgan and that will be his car for most of his life.
Bob,
I agree with you. I asked the question initially because I was curious if anyone thought the impact would change any driving habits in terms of observing. My wife said it best. "This is your hobby, you'll cut something else out so you can still go." Yep, she's right. I know gas won't stop me, the weather is right now, but I'll adjust in other areas.
Also, I have lived in Europe and my wife and I have 3 couples from Denmark, England/Britain and France that are close friends. Petrol prices are often reflected by taxes that are collected to pay for other transportation needs. It also encourages people not to own a car but to use public transportation, even for vacations (plane, train etc.). Our friends in Denmark don't own a car, don't feel the need. Our friends in England own two cars but mainly take public transportation to work. Our friends in France own one car and use it a lot more as they are in the country. One thing not mentioned is the fact that in Europe (western Europe) you also have high costs to register your car. The registration fee for a car can be up to really expensive and is based on a high % of the cars value. Imagine owning a car and having to pay $8000.00 a year just to register it (the tax on a car valued at $20,000 at a 40% tax rate). In addition, many roads are toll roads and so you have to pay to drive on them. Don't drive in Italy or in France if you don't know how to avoid the toll roads and in many cases, just have plenty of change anyway. Bottom line, driving in Europe is more expensive than here. I just wish we had their public transportation.
In terms of visitors to Star Parties I actually think we just may see an increase. Why? While if your in the Tooele area, SPOC is a lot closer than going into SLC and Wheeler is right in the middle of a major metro area and they are both free to the public. When money gets tight, families often look to do things that are free and fun. Sounds like a Star Party evening may be in the plans for some families as the weather improves (will it?).
On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Robert Taylor <robtaylorslc@gmail.com>wrote:
The prices in Europe are from extremely high taxes, not higher cost for oil or refining. If you've ever been to Europe things are also very close, France is just a few hours from Central Germany for example and a LONG road trip in Europe is just a couple of hours. I've been on the famous German Autobahns, if you can get up to high speed and there are not any of the numerous accidents bringing traffic to a standstill, which happens a lot, you don't go very long before you have to get off, things are close. That is not the reality in much of the U.S., certainly not for us here in Utah, which is why we have traditionally taxed fuel much more moderately then Europeans have.
I expect we will see some change in behavior from club members and visitors if gas continues to climb as projected, but not a dramatic change. After all how many of us buy all kind of telescope stuff without too much agonizing. Most of us will just absorb the cost. We didn't get in this hobby because had an aversion to spending money.
Bob
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Wiggins Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2011 12:03 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Will the cost of gas change your dark site visits or your attendance at outreach events?
Hi list,
After this thread wound down I joined a similar thread on one of the international pro-am astronomy lists I'm on.
As I suspected the folks overseas (France $8, Italy $9) don't have a lot of sympathy for our "high" prices here in the US (though I found it refreshing that they put their feelings very diplomatically <g>).
One aspect I had not considered was the lower wages in many of those countries compounding the effects of their truly high fuel prices. I thought that was expressed well in this I received yesterday that may help some of us feel better (and maybe a bit guilty) about our lot.
+++++ I remember that numerous conversations with my friends about gas prices often ended with "Oh those Americans" :)
But let's just stay on the statistical side. I live where a gallon of petrol costs about $7.24 per gallon. In 2005 a gallon was about $4 and that price was constant from late 90's until 2006, when it started to rise (peaked in 2008). But you must look at this in a different light. Average monthly salary is about $1000. Now compare that to the average salary in the US.
So if you want go get from place where I live to seaside (which has became quite popular in the last years) by highway and back (including all tolls), that will set you back about 1/3 of your monthly salary. If you ask me, that's a lot for a 800km trip. +++++
Suddenly the cost of my trip from Stansbury to Wheeler this evening didn't seem so bad.
patrick
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