I was looking down on Cataract Canyon in the Maze District, to our surprize 2 F-16's came flying up the canyon, yes I looked down at 2 F-16's.
Joe,
I initially thought the same thing but then I realized my mistake...5,000 ft above the ground altitude, not sea level.
Dave
"The regulation mandated a nimimum 5,000 foot above ground level altitude over national parks, monuments, recreation areas, and tribal grounds. Essentially it required me to fly at a minimum of 15,000 feet to go over any of these areas."
On Dec 06, 2011, at 02:14 PM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com> wrote:
I don't understand why you had to fly at 15,000 feet if the regulation said 5,000. But to your main point: don't you understand the value of enjoying the peace and quiet of a natural area without a tourist plane buzzing close overhead? Not to be insensitive to you, but the dollars you would make from these flights aren't worth the irritation that possibly thousands of other people would feel when visiting the park, many of whom come from the other side of the country. We need see things from a national perspective sometimes, as Americans who treasure our natural wonders. Best wishes, Joe
________________________________ From: Brent Watson <brentjwatson@yahoo.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 1:54 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton mine update
I started a part 135 air taxi business in 2001. The intent was to use my aircraft to both transport folks to the recretion areas in Utah and surrounding states, and to offer scenic tours of our national parks. I flew a Cessna 182, a single engine non-pressurized, 4 seat aircraft. About 2002, the FAA put forth a new regulation, part 136. This regulation concerned only commercial aircraft like my airplane. The regulation only allowed certain companies to offer scenic tours over national parks. To qualify you needed to apply for a license to offer these tours. I applied and was rejected.
So what you say? The regulation mandated a nimimum 5,000 foot above ground level altitude over national parks, monuments, recreation areas, and tribal grounds. Essentially it required me to fly at a minimum of 15,000 feet to go over any of these areas. Non pressurized aircraft must have an oxygen system for passengers and pilot at this altitude. Pilots must be using the system and it must be offered to passengers. My aircraft is not so equipped. Look at a map and you will see that this regulation effectively prohibited me from flying over a large portion of southern Utah. The Staircase - Escalante national monument is a big blockade that denied me access to this part of our state.
I am definitely not in favor of the arbitrary designation of national monuments by a capricious president. Most assuredly I am not in favor of Clinton's sneaky designation of Staircase - Escalante. He did not even have the courage to come to Utah to make his proclamation.
Shortly after this the Arizona Strip was also given national monument designation, further closing off the southern border.
I am not a fan.
________________________________ From: Steve Fisher <iotacass1@hotmail.com> To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 10:00 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton mine update
Well then I must disagree! With the federal government in control of nearly 60% of the land in Utah, right or wrong I strongly disagree. Nothing I can see gives our federal government this right. We stand very close to having National Parks, Monuments and Recreation areas boarded up and the public will be denied access. Parks are really hurting right now just to maintain the basics and many are in such poor shape that the general public may be at risk just by entering. I hope these closures never happen but it may be interesting to see how some who support what in my opinion is simply a land grab feel when they are turned away at the entrance gate. Alton Coal mines parking lot may be where we set up to observe in the future. Ok, that is "over the top" but you get my point. Steve
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 09:50:03 -0700 From: erikhansen@thebluezone.net To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton mine update
I agree, hardly a negative for Utah.
I don't want to get political, but I view the creation of the national
monument as a great service to Utah and the country. -- Joe
________________________________ From: D P Pierce <starsbirdsglyphs@gmail.com> To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Monday, December 5, 2011 8:42 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Alton mine update
Closer to home the Grand Staircase Escalante National Monument was created by presidental decree.
"The Monument was declared in September 1996 at the height of the 1996 presidential election<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._presidential_election,_1996>campaign by President Bill Clinton <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Clinton>, and was controversial from the moment of creation. The declaration ceremony was held at Grand Canyon National Park<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Canyon_National_Park>in Arizona <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona>, and not in the state of Utah. The Utah congressional delegation and state governor were notified only 24 hours in advance. This was seen by many as a transparent political ploy to gain votes in the contested state of Arizona. That November, Clinton won Arizona by a margin of 2.2%, and lost Utah to Republican Bob Dole <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Dole> by 21.1%" (quote from Wikipedia) I thought at the time Clinton did it to screw Utah because Utah was the only state he had come in 3rd pllace in his first election. I think Kanab High School woke up the next morning to find out half of their football field was in the new national monument. Nobody from Utah was invited to the ceremony. It was especially a slap in the face for former Demcratic senator Frank Moss who had worked diligently to get more national parks in Utah.
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