Yes, thanks again Joe, it is a credibility issue. Most scientists are good, fair, honest and apply good scientific method but there are those who do not and use science as a tool for things other than understanding. I know this for a fact as I have worked with one. I would argue again to let the good ones do there job, the truth will set us all free. BT -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces+rob.taylor=digis.net@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces+rob.taylor=digis.net@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Bauman Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 3:25 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] OT - ClimateGate Tyler, I have immense respect for you and I don't doubt the integrity of scientists you know. But the fact remains that the computer models that are the basis for the entire movement to blame humans for global warming are hideously botched. The institution that gave credibility to that model and the position blaming humans is sullied beyond repair. We need to understand the dynamics of the hysteria, and I think it includes faked results, bad data, a messed-up computer code, intimidation and suppression of information, and apparently some outright fabrication to make the predictions come out the way these people think they are supposed to. It's not as simple as saying this guy or that institution has integrity. What is important here is the analysis of the research and the validity of the numbers the analyzers are cranking into their crazy computer code. The East Anglians are the basis for almost all of the predictions, the basis for the Copenhagen Report, the basis for the EPA's position. If their work is faked, we need to know that and the reevaluate. We can't simply say, well, Bob Jones is a good guy and conducts good research. We have to ask, who is using the research data to get results? Please, please read the CBS correspondent's blog and then tell me if you think everything is just fine with East Anglia. Tell me if they had any reason to hide information. The blog is here: http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/11/24/taking_liberties/entry5761180.shtml Thanks, Joe