July 2013 - Utah-Astronomy - mailman.xmission.com

Re: [Utah-astronomy] Interesting asterism
by Joe Bauman 31 Jul '13

31 Jul '13

The marbles are almost gone from my bottle. ------------------------------ On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 9:01 AM MDT Chuck Hards wrote: >I have to admit that I have no idea what the bottle with marbles is about, >Brent. Right over my head. > >It struck me this morning that the sky is much darker at 6:00 AM than it >was just 5 weeks ago. A few more weeks and we'll see red, orange and >yellow highlighting the mountains. > >On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:06 AM, Brent Watson <brentjwatson(a)yahoo.com>wrote: > >> Have you prepared the bottle with marbles in it yet? We're too youung to >> think about that. >> >> >> >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Tube for sale
by Chuck Hards 31 Jul '13

31 Jul '13

I just called you and left a message. I'm interested in the tube. Thanks, C. On Jul 23, 2013 4:57 PM, "Siegfried Jachmann" <siegfried(a)jachmann.org> wrote: > > I have for sale an aluminum tube 14" in diameter, 10' long, suitable for a > 12" long focus telescope. I will not be using that myself for a telescope > as once planned. > > Siegfried >

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Persied Shower 1993
by D P Pierce 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

One of my favorite memories is the Persied meteor shower of 1993. Comet Swift-Tuttle had returned for the first time since its discovery in 1962 so everyone was expecting a great show. The moon phase was good. A crescent came up about dawn. About 300 watchers started the night on Little Mountain. Most were gone by midnight Fire balls were seen before total darkness! A half dozen of us organized so we could cover the whole sky. We had click counters keeping both hourly and accumulative counts. Between 2:00am and 3:00am we counted over 150 and a total of over 750 for the night! I remember meteorites splitting and then splitting again. Brent Watson, Patrick Wiggins, my wife Karen, and myself stayed till dawn. What a memory! Deloy

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Persied watch
by John M. Craig 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

I'm not sure how I so thoroughly misread the S&T mention of the *morning* of the 12th as being the best time for N. American observers. Leaving aside questions of the conversion of UTC to MDT, the IMO does say pretty clearly that: "The near-nodal part of the Â‘traditionalÂ’ maximum interval would be best-viewed from extreme eastern Europe eastwards across much of Asia, assuming it happens as expected." So, I guess we enjoy whatever we get on the night of the 11th/12th. In any case, I'm not sure we'll be available to join folks at SPOC. John

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Perseid shower
by daniel turner 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

Meteor showers, like comets, tend to be over promoted as an observing event. I've had people show up at sunset on the evening of a shower peak and ask "where are the meteors?" Then fifteen minutes later, their attention span expires and they are back in their car leaving as they phone all their friends telling them not to bother looking. These people have an expectation that the shower is an single point in time event and they expect it to be over in less time than a episode of their favorite TV show. The fact is that you can see Perseid and Leonid meteors for a week before and after the supposed "peak". And the peaks themselves are almost never noticeably more memorable than the rest of the shower. Like any astronomy observation, patience and perseverance are required to appreciate what's going on. So switch to decaf, slow down and spend some time to enjoy the event over it's full timespan. Even if the "peak" comes at noon local time, that just means you have two equally good evenings on either side of it. And a week before and after the peak you can notice the shower, if you can find the time to spend on it. DT

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Eye v. Camera
by Joe Bauman 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

We can prove the universe existed at a time when nobody could see it. That's scientific proof. The notion that it exists only because we ot other life forms ard around to witness it is delusional, giving ourselves far too important a role. To the question, what difference does it make?, I say the difference in one's perceptions matters a great deal. Why bother to protect the environment or even care about anyone if none of it matters after you die? The feeling that life goes on after yourself is why we try to make the world a better place. It's why people write wills. The difference in attitudes is the difference between self-absorbed egoism and a more caring temperament, so it does matter. I happen to know from personal experience that you're a nice guy, Chuck, so I think you believe in the reality of the experiences and existence of others. ------------------------------ On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 2:54 PM MDT Chuck Hards wrote: >Hi Joe, that's an old argument, I hope you didn't post it for my benefit >alone. I understand the point of view. But the older I get, the less >satisfying it is. > >To me, the correct answer to the question of 'is there a sound when a tree >falls with no-one to hear it', or 'is there a universe if there is no life >in it', is: *It doesn't matter*. The question, ultimately, isn't worth >asking. It's just words with no value. > >A universe of particles and fields governed by a set of physical laws, with >no intelligence in it, only matters to certain university faculty members >who need a paycheck from the idea. And obviously they would exist in a >different universe. > >I'm one of those who is pretty sure that this universe ends when I die. At >least as far as I'm concerned. If I'm wrong, then I'll be pleasantly >surprised, won't I? And if there is a continuation after this life, it is >bound to be so different and disconnected from this plane and it's >experiences, that it isn't worth speculating about. Such musings are >bandied-about so we can sleep better at night. More words with no >intrinsic value. > >Your mileage may vary. > >On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > >> >> >> Hi Chuck, if by "make a sound" you mean send out sound waves, then yes, >> the tree that falls in the forest with nobody around to hear it does make a >> sound. The question about the universe's existance, or not, if there were >> no life to appreciate it is an interesting one. It can be compared to >> asking if the universe exists after one's own death. Woody Alien seems to >> take the position that it won't, in Hannah and Her Sisters when he thinks >> he's dying and imagines that the places he loves (and everything else, of >> course) will no longer exist. These are points worth thinking about. My >> feeling is that the universe didn't come into existence just for my >> benefit. It will continue after I'm gone, just as Woody's favorite places >> will after he dies. The universe exists whether or not anyone observes it. >> The sound and light vibrations will be the same. The light of the early >> universe began propagating before any life came along to see it; we can >> detect it today but >> that doesn't mean it was not there at the time of the Big Bang. >> >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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Eye v. Camera
by jcarman6＠q.com 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

My memory is as good as ever - thank you very much, Mr. Watson !! I won't venture to suggest catching YOU on the downside is as rare as an eclipse, but it does happen and should reside in everyone's memory for all eternity (and that is a verrra long time). If and when we meet on the other side, I will still ask you if you know the difference between M13 and M92. You might know a little more by then :) I agree with both Chuck and Joe (and thanks Joe for corrobor ation of my 1991 observation - MAYBE now Brent will accept it snicker snicker - as it comes from a man. He wouldn't take my identification of M13 until Scott Crosby - a man- agreed with me ). In all seriousness, the "over" processing of digital photos should be a real concern. There are some fantastic images out there, but the question is - are they real. Has the photographer processed the image in such a way as to add "detail" that doesn't really exist in reality. Can that misinformation lead us astray as to what is really going on? As a side note on the subject, personal observation still stands equal to if not better than a photograph.

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Cricket chirping
by D P Pierce 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

Joe I love listening to crickets chirping. It mellows me out. * I wish there were crickets where I live.* ** *Deloy*

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Comic
by D P Pierce 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

http://beetlebailey.com/ If the alien was blue it would look like a Smurf. Maybe the Smurfs are aliens, Deloy

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Eye v. Camera
by Joe Bauman 30 Jul '13

30 Jul '13

Hi Chuck, if by "make a sound" you mean send out sound waves, then yes, the tree that falls in the forest with nobody around to hear it does make a sound. The question about the universe's existance, or not, if there were no life to appreciate it is an interesting one. It can be compared to asking if the universe exists after one's own death. Woody Alien seems to take the position that it won't, in Hannah and Her Sisters when he thinks he's dying and imagines that the places he loves (and everything else, of course) will no longer exist. These are points worth thinking about. My feeling is that the universe didn't come into existence just for my benefit. It will continue after I'm gone, just as Woody's favorite places will after he dies. The universe exists whether or not anyone observes it. The sound and light vibrations will be the same. The light of the early universe began propagating before any life came along to see it; we can detect it today but that doesn't mean it was not there at the time of the Big Bang. -- Joe ------------------------------ On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 1:20 PM MDT Chuck Hards wrote: >The digital camera is especially bad at recording what the eye sees, much >more so that emulsion films, IMO. I constantly see over-saturated photos >with color so vibrant that it doesn't even look real. Of course much of >this is from over-zealous post-processing. > >I've taken digital pictures of parts of my garden, and soil that is dark >brown to the eye is white or grey to the camera even without post-exposure >processing, and IR & UV filters employed. It's picking-up wavelengths that >we don't even see. > >I think this is a big reason why photographers fancy themselves "artists" >for the most part, rather than "historians" or "journalists". Images today >aren't faithfully representative of what was really there, they are what >the imager can do with the data he/she took. > >And ultimately it all gets back to the universe only really existing in the >minds of those who observe it, interact with it. > >If a tree falls in the forest, and nobody is around, does it make a sound? >If there is no-one in the universe to wonder at it all, and their place in >it, does it even exist? >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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