August 2003 - Utah-Astronomy - mailman.xmission.com

RE: [Utah-astronomy] Green laser backlash
by Kim Hyatt 11 Aug '03

11 Aug '03

That night at Wolf Creek pass the air was nearly perfectly transparent. Even sighting along the barrel of the laser pointer, the beam was barely visible - not even bright enough to use as an aiming tool, at least for me. This weekend I had some fun with it in Yellowstone. We stayed up late to watch Grand Geyser. While returning to our car around 10:30, I played with the laser in the steam of a couple hot springs and small geysers. The "show" was kind of fun. My dogs also love to chase my red pointer. (I don't use the green ponter in the house.) Small minds, simple pleasures... -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Hards [mailto:chuckhards@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 10:04 AM To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: RE: [Utah-astronomy] Green laser backlash --- Kim Hyatt <khyatt(a)smithlayton.com> wrote: > While I tried to > use the laser at Wolf > Creek, the air was so clear that the laser was > absolutely useless. Used as a pointer, this can be a problem (what a problem- perfect transparancy!), but I've noticed that even in very clear air, the beam can be seen if your line-of-sight is almost co-axial with it, so it still may work as a "finder" mounted on a telescope. I've used a red one this way (before abandoning it as a step backwards). For a real show, take out your laser this winter, during a snowstorm. They are also great fun annoying stray cats, who can't catch that dot no matter how hard they try! C. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] Green laser backlash
by Kim Hyatt 11 Aug '03

11 Aug '03

A couple thoughts: I recently purchased a green laser pointer, mainly for use at public star parties where I'd be surprised if anyone was attempting serious imaging. In the past, I've used a bright flashlight with a narrow beam, as I've noticed others using. While I tried to use the laser at Wolf Creek, the air was so clear that the laser was absolutely useless. I think we might consider an informal "policy" (or at least a request) to limit/ban the use of pointers of any kind at private star parties. For example, a bright flashlight was used by someone at a priviate star party where I was hoping to do some wide-angle photography. The flashlight and the observer's choice of sites to set up (between me and my south horizon) foiled my imaging attempts for that night. Since some laser manufacturers are promoting its use as a telescope aiming device, this genie may already be on the loose. Why not experiment with green lasers some evening at SPOC and see if the beam as most would use it really can affect imaging? We should consider wide-angle, long-exposure photography (such as I still do), CCD imaging, etc. How about it? -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Hards [mailto:chuckhards@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, August 11, 2003 8:59 AM To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: RE: [Utah-astronomy] Green laser backlash Thanks Paul & Jim for your insights. Seems like this is just another variation on music at star parties. Some folks like it, some don't. The pointer would be appropriate for an outreach-type, public education star-party, scouting event, etc., but should probably be kept under wraps during dark-sky, "serious" (whatever that means) viewing or imaging sessions, club "dark of the moon" nights. In 1997, when I was going-out every clear night (and morning!) to shoot comet Hale-Bopp (images for the gallery coming SOON!), my biggest annoyance was airplanes. One-fourth of my frames were marred by jets passing-through the field; since my eye was glued to the narrow field of the guiding eyepiece for all of the 3-to-5 minuite exposures, I never noticed them until I had the rolls processed. Nothing can be done about jets, but if I had found several green laser "trails" on those exposures, there's a good chance I would have had a confrontation with the wielder. C. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy

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Green laser backlash
by Chuck Hards 11 Aug '03

11 Aug '03

I've read recently of a growing scorn of green laser pointers at star parties, due to their rapid proliferation and easily-seen beam. It seems that so many people are using them that other observers are beginning to speak out against them as light pollution on the field. Especially imagers & astro-photographers. I've been hankering for one of those for a long time, but if it's going to irritate people, perhaps I'd better not. Have any list members experienced this? Is this just at the large, regional star parties, or are camps pro & con forming up at the local level? Particularly would like feedback from owners & frequent users of green pointers. Thanks! Chuck __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com

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FW: 2003 Darwin Awards
by Kim Hyatt 11 Aug '03

11 Aug '03

Patrick, you may want to pay attention if you still plan to jump out of a plane with a bowling ball... Darwin Awards 2003. In case you have been waiting breathlessly for this year's Darwin Awards,here they are. The awards this year are, once again, truly classic.These awards are given each year to bestow upon (the remains of) that individual, who through single-minded self-sacrifice, has done the most to remove undesirable elements from the human gene pool. Just think... until these events, these same people were walking the streets like normal people. 5th RUNNER-UP: Goes to a San Anselmo, California man who died when he hit a lift tower at the Mammoth Mountain ski area while riding down the slope on a foam pad. Thirty-year old David Hubal was pronounced dead at Central Mammoth Hospital. The accident occurred about 3 a.m., the Mono County Sheriff's department. Hubal and his friends apparently had hiked up a ski run called Stump Alley and undid some yellow foam protectors from lift towers, said Lt. Mike of the Mammoth Lakes Police Department. The pads are used to protect skiers who might hit towers. The group apparently used the pads to slide down the ski slope and Hubal crashed into a tower. It has since been investigated and determined the tower he hit was the one with its pad removed. 4th RUNNER-UP: Goes to Robert Puelo, 32, was apparently being disorderly in a St. Louis market. When the clerk threatened to call the police, Puelo grabbed a hotdog, shoved it into his mouth and walked out without paying. Police found him unconscious in front of the store. Paramedics removed the six-inch wiener from his throat where it had choked him to death. 3rd RUNNER-UP: Goes to poacher Marino Malerba of Spain, who shot a stag standing above him on an overhanging rock and was killed instantly when it fell on him. 2nd RUNNER-UP: "Man loses face at party." A man at a West Virginia party (probably related to the winner last year, a man in Arkansas who used the .22 bullet to replace the fuse in his pickup truck) popped a blasting cap into his mouth and bit down, triggering an explosion that blew off his lips, teeth, and tongue. Jerry Stromyer, 24, of Kincaid, bit the blasting cap as a prank during the party late Tuesday night, said Cpl. M.D. Payne. "Another man had it in an aquarium hooked to a battery and was trying to explode it." "It wouldn't go off and this guy said I'll show you how to set it off." He put it into his mouth, bit down and it blew all his teeth out and his lips and tongue off, Payne said. Stromyer was listed in guarded condition Wednesday with extensive facial injuries, according to a spokesperson at Charleston Area Medical Division. "I just can't imagine anyone doing something like that," Payne said. 1st RUNNER-UP: Doctors at Portland University Hospital said an Oregon man shot through the skull by a hunting arrow is lucky to be alive and will be released soon from the hospital. Tony Roberts, 25, lost his right eye last weekend during an initiation into a men's rafting club, Mountain Men Anonymous (probably now known as Stupid Mountain Men Anonymous) in Grants Pass, Oregon. A friend tried to shoot a beer can off his head, but the arrow entered Robert's right eye. Doctors said that had the arrow gone 1 millimeter to the left, a major blood vessel would have been cut and Roberts would have died instantly.Neurosurgeon Doctor Johnny Delashaw at he University Hospital in Portland said the arrow went through 8 to 10 inches of brain with the tip protruding at the rear of his skull, yet somehow managed to miss all major blood vessels. Delashaw also said that had Roberts tried to pull the arrow out on his own he surely would have killed himself. Roberts admitted afterwards that he and his friends had been drinking that afternoon. Said Roberts, I feel so dumb about this" No charges have been filed, but the Josephine County district attorney's office said the initiation stunt is under investigation. Now, THIS YEAR'S WINNER: ( The late) John Pernicky and his friend, (the late) Sal Hawkins, of the great state of Washington, decided to attend a local Metallica concert at the George Washington amphitheater. Having no tickets (but having had 18 beers between them), they thought it would be easy to "hop" over the nine foot fence and sneak into the show. They pulled their pickup truck over to the fence and the plan was for Mr. Pernicky, who was 100 pounds heavier than Mr. Hawkins) to hop the fence and then assist his friend over. Unfortunately for (the late) Mr. Pernicky, there was a 30-foot drop on the other side of the fence. Having heaved himself over, he found himself crashing through a tree. His fall was abruptly halted (and broken, along with his arm) by a large branch that snagged him by his shorts. Dangling from the tree with a broken arm, he looked down and saw some bushes below him. Possibly figuring the bushes would break his fall, he removed his knife and proceeded to cut away his shorts to free himself from the tree. Finally free, Mr. Pernicky crashed into holly bushes. The sharp leaves scratched his entire body and now, without the protection of his shorts, a holly branch penetrated his rectum. To make matters worse, on landing his pocket knife penetrated his thigh. Hawkins, seeing his friend inconsiderable pain and agony, threw him a rope and tried to pull him to safety by tying the rope to the pickup truck and slowly driving away. However, in his drunken haste/state, he put the truck into reverse and crashed through the fence landing on his friend and killing him. Police arrived to find the crashed pickup with its driver thrown 100 feet from the truck and dead at the scene from massive internal injuries. Upon moving the truck, they found John under it half-naked, scratches on his body, a holly in his rectum, a knife in his thigh, and his shorts dangling from a tree branch 25 feet in the air. Congratulations gentlemen, you win...

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SPOC MarsWatch
by Chuck Hards 10 Aug '03

10 Aug '03

Many thanks to Bruce Grim & SLAS for the impromptu MarsWatch Saturday morning, and Patrick for helping spread the word. I watched the fat gibbous moon set as I drove out on I-80. Since 205 is shut-down, my drive time to Stansbury has increased, but still not too bad at three in the morning. Several people were already there, Patrick's Brandt refractor on the "big" mount tracking faithfully. Surface details were readily seen, both with and without a red filter. The polar cap, melt line, and Syrtis Major were prominent. Patrick punched-up the S&T Mars Profiler on the computer, and verified the position of Syrtis Major. A light blue filter did nothing to improve detial, but to my eye reduced glare a bit. A light green filter was marginally better. The red filter effectively eliminated the residual chromatic abberation of the big objective, and I overheard a conversation between two red-green colorblind individuals who both saw more detail with the red filter. The seeing was only poor-to-fair. The air was in constant motion, clouds dogged the planet and only intermittant viewing was possible. You had to stare for a minute or longer, at times, for the image to steady-up enough for a crisp instant, then mentally examine the afterimage in your mind. The atmosphere is always the biggest impediment to high-quality views of Mars and this was a reminder, as I know the Brandt to be capable of exquisite imagery. The atmosphere wouldn't support very high magnifications. Even in the spaces between the opaque clouds, semi-transparent mist obscured the planet. The turbulence of the atmosphere was demonstrated by an amazing "wave" cloud that had formed over the Ochre mountains just to our east, illuminated from the ground by light pollution. Lightning miles distant to the north nevertheless illuminated the observatory as brilliantly as day, with brief, periodic flashes. I had the 20x80mm binos on the parallelogram, looking at whatever happened to be in the sucker holes. With the 25x100mm binos on a tripod, several of us got a look at M13, not more than a few degrees above the horizon and buried in the ground haze, yet still glorious. M57 was readily seen in the 25x100mm binos by myself and Bruce (anybody else see the Ring in there?). The Pleiades were stunning in both binos, and Mars actually showed as an obvious disk! I saw a bright meteor in the 80mm binos, probably an early Persied judging from direction of travel. Adjourned to the truck stop about 5 for refreshment, debriefing, and a chance to count mosquito bites. It was great to meet some of you face-to-face. I had a fun time despite being half asleep! Even "Touring the Universe on Crutches" author Glen Warchol made an appearance, as well as former SLAS president Siegfried, with sibling in-tow. Gotta do this again soon, hope for better seeing! Chuck __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com

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Photos
by Barney B. 07 Aug '03

07 Aug '03

I know there are a lot of variables, but, assuming an 8" f10 scope at 200x and using 1600 speed film, how fast (range) should my shutter speed be to capture Mars? What about a photo shot at "prime" rather than using eyepiece projection? TIA. Barney B.

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Moon & stuff
by Chuck Hards 07 Aug '03

07 Aug '03

Looking at the moon at sunset tonight, trying out a new binocular. Spotted Copernicus immediately at 25x, then realized that it was still in shadow, with only the highest portions in sunlight, nevertheless clearly delineating the crater. Beautiful view, if you can dodge the intermittant clouds. Also looked at the Wasatch front, along the peak of the ridgeline. Surprised at the number of telecommunications towers interspersed with the giant firs. I spent a lot of time climbing those mountains 25 years ago, when a tower was a rare thing. They came as a shock, but in light of the changes in the telecom. industry in that time, I suppose they shouldn't have. Struck by the huge trees growing defiantly out of a sheer rock face...can you imagine the weather extremes those trees not only live in, but thrive in numbers? The tenacity of life is astounding. With the low sun angle, rock layers stood out clearly. Millions of years of deposition, folding, upthrusting, all laid out for me to see. How many geologists, I wondered, cut their teeth as students poring over these incredible mountains? What a planet, eh? Anyway, go look at the moon if you can! C. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com

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Greetings!
by Jon Christensen 06 Aug '03

06 Aug '03

I just joined the list and thought I would drop a post and introduce myself. I have always been interested in the physical sciences: Astronomy, Cosmology, Quantum Physics ect. I have a telescope that I am admitedly not very proficient at using, but hey it's still fun. It's a smallish Target edition Meade Newtonian. Living along the Wasatch Front I tend to forget how astonishing the skies look at night away from all the lights. I just returned from a week-long camping trip to the Wind River mountians in Wyoming where I spent most of the nights in a lounge chair counting satelites, shooting stars and marveling at the Milky Way. I remember when I could see the Milky way from my front yard, it has been years since that was possible. It nearly made me sad to see the wasatch front sky that first night when I returned from Wyoming. It made me wonder how many kids are growing up here with no idea how impressive the night can be. Looking up and wondering "what ifs" are some of my earliest memories of childhood, I'm not sure if I was born today it would have been the same. Thanks for listening to my rambles, Jon Christensen Coldari(a)msn.comGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com

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Bad Storm
by Gary Liptrot 05 Aug '03

05 Aug '03

What a horrific storm Sunday night. I live in a neighborhood that looses power in a drizzling rain and 20 mph winds but here in Ogden we got a Hurricane. I lost a couple of big branches off of my walnut trees and it blew down my dipole Ham radio antenna but I faired better than most. My power was out from 2 in the afternoon until 10:30 that night. After about four hours of being without electricity I thought to myself that I need to get my solar batteries out of my car anyway so this is a good opportunity. By the way, my car was hit from behind in SLC and it destroyed my portable Ham antenna and the right rear end of my poor Blazer. So I needed to get my solar stuff out so they can fix it next week. (Anyone else have two solar panels on their vehicle... B) ) Anyway, I put my two battery boxes in the dining room (120 pounds per box, hard to lift) and hooked up my inverter to a flourescent light and my laptop. Then my wife and I sat down and watched my new "Dare Devil" DVD on the laptop. Hey, it wasn't exactly surround sound but it was cozy. Later we cooked Tacos on the Propane grill. Soon I need to "Bartelize" one of my scopes and use this solar technology to power the drives, laptop, CCD etc.. Of course up here my friends know me for how slow I build stuff but hey I have fun. I know, I know, I can hear Dave, Lee, Brent and Chuck saying, when are ya going to finish that 16 inch mirror ya slow poke? Soon guys, soon, after all I just got some eyepiece lenses in the mail and I need to distract myself with them for a while... B) Side note, last week I went with OAS to Monte Cristo and we got a storm nearly equal to this one only I was in a tent that night, can you spell soggy. Tnx es 73 de n7zi Gary "Why buy something for ten bucks when you can make it for a hundred.", J.R.

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Mars
by Richard Tenney 05 Aug '03

05 Aug '03

I set my alarm last night for about 2:45 this morning and was rewarded with a great view of Mars through my humble 6-inch f/8 Newtonian. Even at a modest 152x (using an 8mm ploessl) the detail was surprisingly good. Bottom line: you certainly don't have to own a giant light bucket, or wait until the 27th, for spectacular views of the "angry red planet". Tonight's forecast calls for clear skies... Rich __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com

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