(usr-tc) ISDN leased line on DSP?
OK...this is a bizarre one.. I have a customer wanting to upgrade from 2 channel ISDN, to a 2 channel leased line type of set up (don't ask, I'm not sure why). In any case, they have an ISDN PRI into their location to support their voice traffic on their PBX. What they want to do (and apparently have an Adtran unit to do this on their end) is to pull two channels off the PRI and hand them to a cisco 1600 as a nailed up data connection (ie, no dialing). I know that you can set up an ISDN leased line connection like this, but I've never seen anyone pull two channels off a PRI to do this. *shrug* In any case...this setup is giving our mutual CLEC telephone company fits on how to do this. Being a leased line setup, my initial response was to say, "OK, drop that to me on a frac-t1 connection to my cisco 3640 down there." I *think* this can be made to work...the tech dude at the telco (who's pretty sharp and friendly) thinks he can get this delivered to my 3640 on a frac-t1... Now...I like our telco down there a lot...they're good guys, so I want to try to help them out if I can...and besides...I wanna do this setup without doing alot of really weird provisioning, as that tends to cause problems down the line. So, my question boils down to... Can a DSP be made to use two channels as an ISDN leased line connection? My thinking being that if I could peel off two channels of one of my PRIs, it might be easier, simpler, more reliable, etc. to take my two channels and patch them through the switch to these folks two channels, rather than having to add/drop mux it out somewhere, convert it to a frac-t1, and proly several other weird gyrations, to get the connection to me. Not being a telco tech, I'm not sure if this would be easier to do or not...I can't imagine it would make it harder, but who knows. But before I offered to the telco tech dude, I wanted to make sure the DSPs would indeed do this. The impression I've gotten from what I've looked at so far, is that no, the DSPs *won't* do this...but I'd like to get some confirmation from folks that know more about this than I. Thanks! P.S. Still no response from anyone of any signficance about the news server on totalservice. :/ -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456 - To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
Are you sure the Adtran is set up to add/drop from a PRI? That would put a lot of intelligence in the Adtran that is not normally included in a csu/dsu in order to deal with the D channel call setup stuff. It is my understanding that a PRI isn't really sliced up just like a CT1. We provide the same functionality to a few of our clients using an Ascend router configured in the 'nailed' mode. This essentially creates a leased line between their router and the dsp, and has the advantage of moving to other PRI's if one of them fails for any reason. We set up our end to never dump that call for any sort of timeout. Mark Thornton San Marcos Internet, Inc. 512-393-5300 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Mcadams" <jeffm@iglou.com> To: <usr-tc@lists.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2000 2:20 PM Subject: (usr-tc) ISDN leased line on DSP?
OK...this is a bizarre one..
I have a customer wanting to upgrade from 2 channel ISDN, to a 2 channel leased line type of set up (don't ask, I'm not sure why). In any case, they have an ISDN PRI into their location to support their voice traffic on their PBX. What they want to do (and apparently have an Adtran unit to do this on their end) is to pull two channels off the PRI and hand them to a cisco 1600 as a nailed up data connection (ie, no dialing). I know that you can set up an ISDN leased line connection like this, but I've never seen anyone pull two channels off a PRI to do this. *shrug*
In any case...this setup is giving our mutual CLEC telephone company fits on how to do this. Being a leased line setup, my initial response was to say, "OK, drop that to me on a frac-t1 connection to my cisco 3640 down there." I *think* this can be made to work...the tech dude at the telco (who's pretty sharp and friendly) thinks he can get this delivered to my 3640 on a frac-t1...
Now...I like our telco down there a lot...they're good guys, so I want to try to help them out if I can...and besides...I wanna do this setup without doing alot of really weird provisioning, as that tends to cause problems down the line. So, my question boils down to...
Can a DSP be made to use two channels as an ISDN leased line connection? My thinking being that if I could peel off two channels of one of my PRIs, it might be easier, simpler, more reliable, etc. to take my two channels and patch them through the switch to these folks two channels, rather than having to add/drop mux it out somewhere, convert it to a frac-t1, and proly several other weird gyrations, to get the connection to me. Not being a telco tech, I'm not sure if this would be easier to do or not...I can't imagine it would make it harder, but who knows. But before I offered to the telco tech dude, I wanted to make sure the DSPs would indeed do this. The impression I've gotten from what I've looked at so far, is that no, the DSPs *won't* do this...but I'd like to get some confirmation from folks that know more about this than I.
Thanks!
P.S. Still no response from anyone of any signficance about the news server on totalservice. :/ -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
Also sprach Mark Thornton
Are you sure the Adtran is set up to add/drop from a PRI? That would put a lot of intelligence in the Adtran that is not normally included in a csu/dsu in order to deal with the D channel call setup stuff. It is my understanding that a PRI isn't really sliced up just like a CT1.
Yeah...I looked at some of the Adtran stuff...it looks like they have some rather intelligent "CSU/DSU's"...up to the point of doing IP routing to some degree. It looks like it can seriously slice and dice a connection any way you want it...with some of their equipment, it looks like it'll even drop a single DS0 out of a DS3 like this. I've called the consultant dude working on this whole setup to try to find out the actual Adtran unit that they're using, in the hopes that it might tell me a bit more about the setup they're doing and how it might affect us.
We provide the same functionality to a few of our clients using an Ascend router configured in the 'nailed' mode. This essentially creates a leased line between their router and the dsp, and has the advantage of moving to other PRI's if one of them fails for any reason. We set up our end to never dump that call for any sort of timeout.
Ugh...don't get me started. I suggested a channelized T1, to pull of channels to do this...they already had the PRI in place. I suggested taking the PRI into the PBX and then provision a BRI out of the PBX to a BRI router and do a nailed dial-up connection like you suggested. They already had the Cisco 1600 and didn't want to purchase the BRI card for it, and already had the Adtran to break out the two PRI channels. *cue rant about people ordering equipment and services before knowing if it will work end-to-end or not* *sigh* Anyway...I'm not wanting to put a whole lot of work into this, since the customer and consultant pretty much have their minds made up on how they want to do this, and aren't willing to consider suggestions on better ways to handle it, but I thought I'd ask to see if you could set aside ISDN leased line channels on a DSP. I know such a thing as an ISDN leased line exists, and its not a dialed connection, but didn't know if the DSPs supported it. -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456 - To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
On Wed, 20 Sep 2000, Jeff Mcadams wrote:
Anyway...I'm not wanting to put a whole lot of work into this, since the customer and consultant pretty much have their minds made up on how they want to do this, and aren't willing to consider suggestions on better ways to handle it, but I thought I'd ask to see if you could set aside ISDN leased line channels on a DSP. I know such a thing as an ISDN leased line exists, and its not a dialed connection, but didn't know if the DSPs supported it.
The only thing that comes to mind here is that this would only work if your telco and their telco were the same entity... Otherwise I can't imagine this working. I've never heard of any centrex-type service going cross-carrier... Just another possible data point. Charles
-- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
Also sprach Charles Sprickman
The only thing that comes to mind here is that this would only work if your telco and their telco were the same entity... Otherwise I can't imagine this working. I've never heard of any centrex-type service going cross-carrier...
Yup, same telco...so no problems there. -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456 - To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
I tried this a while ago with BELL/Verizon.. I ordered an point to point ISDN circuit.. it showed up as a plain old ISDN but with no useage charges, I just paid by the mile. But everything else was a plain old ISDN circuit... plugged it into a courier I modem and let her rip. So I guess your CLEC could reroute it to a pair on you PRI if they can pull them out of the circuit and reassign them to that dedicated link. It might not be tarriffed to work that way, but if they are willing to try it... Paul Farber Farber Technology farber@admin.f-tech.net Ph 570-628-5303 Fax 570-628-5545 On Wed, 20 Sep 2000, Jeff Mcadams wrote:
OK...this is a bizarre one..
I have a customer wanting to upgrade from 2 channel ISDN, to a 2 channel leased line type of set up (don't ask, I'm not sure why). In any case, they have an ISDN PRI into their location to support their voice traffic on their PBX. What they want to do (and apparently have an Adtran unit to do this on their end) is to pull two channels off the PRI and hand them to a cisco 1600 as a nailed up data connection (ie, no dialing). I know that you can set up an ISDN leased line connection like this, but I've never seen anyone pull two channels off a PRI to do this. *shrug*
In any case...this setup is giving our mutual CLEC telephone company fits on how to do this. Being a leased line setup, my initial response was to say, "OK, drop that to me on a frac-t1 connection to my cisco 3640 down there." I *think* this can be made to work...the tech dude at the telco (who's pretty sharp and friendly) thinks he can get this delivered to my 3640 on a frac-t1...
Now...I like our telco down there a lot...they're good guys, so I want to try to help them out if I can...and besides...I wanna do this setup without doing alot of really weird provisioning, as that tends to cause problems down the line. So, my question boils down to...
Can a DSP be made to use two channels as an ISDN leased line connection? My thinking being that if I could peel off two channels of one of my PRIs, it might be easier, simpler, more reliable, etc. to take my two channels and patch them through the switch to these folks two channels, rather than having to add/drop mux it out somewhere, convert it to a frac-t1, and proly several other weird gyrations, to get the connection to me. Not being a telco tech, I'm not sure if this would be easier to do or not...I can't imagine it would make it harder, but who knows. But before I offered to the telco tech dude, I wanted to make sure the DSPs would indeed do this. The impression I've gotten from what I've looked at so far, is that no, the DSPs *won't* do this...but I'd like to get some confirmation from folks that know more about this than I.
Thanks!
P.S. Still no response from anyone of any signficance about the news server on totalservice. :/ -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
Also sprach Paul Farber
I tried this a while ago with BELL/Verizon.. I ordered an point to point ISDN circuit.. it showed up as a plain old ISDN but with no useage charges, I just paid by the mile.
Right...and its not dialed, correct? It just comes up and is connected through as a clear connection. Did you have to set up multi-link to be able to have a 128kbps channel on that? Or was it a clear 128kbps channel? That's one thing I wasn't sure on...I was assuming it'd require MP, but hadn't ever actually experienced it, so didn't know for sure.
But everything else was a plain old ISDN circuit... plugged it into a courier I modem and let her rip. So I guess your CLEC could reroute it to a pair on you PRI if they can pull them out of the circuit and reassign them to that dedicated link.
Right...I thought it might be easier for the CLEC to do that...I'm not sure if you can configure the DSP to do that though.
It might not be tarriffed to work that way, but if they are willing to try it...
Oh...these are good people...they're willing to give just about anything a try. It helps that they seem to really like me and IgLou. :) -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456 - To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
I *think* it came up as a MLPPP circuit.... there was really nothing to it.. I got a spid and had to give the modem a different init string (ignore carrier.. cant remember.. the circuit was taken down a few months ago.) Paul Farber Farber Technology farber@admin.f-tech.net Ph 570-628-5303 Fax 570-628-5545 On Wed, 20 Sep 2000, Jeff Mcadams wrote:
Also sprach Paul Farber
I tried this a while ago with BELL/Verizon.. I ordered an point to point ISDN circuit.. it showed up as a plain old ISDN but with no useage charges, I just paid by the mile.
Right...and its not dialed, correct? It just comes up and is connected through as a clear connection. Did you have to set up multi-link to be able to have a 128kbps channel on that? Or was it a clear 128kbps channel? That's one thing I wasn't sure on...I was assuming it'd require MP, but hadn't ever actually experienced it, so didn't know for sure.
But everything else was a plain old ISDN circuit... plugged it into a courier I modem and let her rip. So I guess your CLEC could reroute it to a pair on you PRI if they can pull them out of the circuit and reassign them to that dedicated link.
Right...I thought it might be easier for the CLEC to do that...I'm not sure if you can configure the DSP to do that though.
It might not be tarriffed to work that way, but if they are willing to try it...
Oh...these are good people...they're willing to give just about anything a try. It helps that they seem to really like me and IgLou. :) -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
- To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
Also sprach Paul Farber
I *think* it came up as a MLPPP circuit....
OK...that's what I thought...I'm not aware of any support at the ISDN level for making multiple channels into a bigger single pipe like there is for fractional-T1's.
there was really nothing to it.. I got a spid and had to give the modem a different init string (ignore carrier.. cant remember.. the circuit was taken down a few months ago.)
Probably ignore carrier and just to answer or originate without dialing probably. I didn't figure it was a big deal...thanks for the input though. :) -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456 - To unsubscribe to usr-tc, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe usr-tc" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.
participants (4)
-
Charles Sprickman -
Jeff Mcadams -
Mark Thornton -
Paul Farber