Re: M_Boats: Stern light mounting location?
Ah, good call! Starboard seems like a good idea ( why didn't I think of that?) And I bet much more appropriate then wood. A small chunk would probably be cheap, too. As for the requirements,just because I'm irrationally into colored lights, I'll beg to differ. As far as I can tell, per International and inland navigation rules, rule 22c, vessels less than 12 meters in length, the Stern light, along with masthead, towing, or all-round, is required to be visible to 2 nautical miles. Sidelights are 1 nmi. Granted, since m17s are less than 7 meters in length, they might arguably fall under the contingency in 25d, having ready at hand a light to show "in sufficient time to prevent collision", but it seems unfair to call it impractical to show the standard lights on an m17. Maybe I've misinterpreted this? I'm genuinely curious. Not that I think it would ever actually come up, of course. How would the coast guard even measure that? Dan Farrell M17 #301 John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
The CG only cares that the light is visible as required for the boat it's on; they don't care how it's mounted. For our little boats, 1 NM is all that's required.
I cut a wedge from a piece of 1" kingboard/starboard - in fact from the scrap piece that Dave Scobie generously sent me many many months ago.
More detail - I measured the diameter of the light base (same Perko you have probably) and then cut a wedge from rectangular stock with that diagonal measure on a table saw. Then I took that and cut a round out of it using an appropriately large hole saw (on a drill press, which made it easier to keep the cut perpendicular to what will be the top face of the material).
End result - round wedge that tapers from 1" to zero, diameter about 1/8" bigger than the light base.
I just need to pull the light off and re-mount with the wedge under it. I'll mount the wedge with small machine bolts thru the coaming. Light will screw back onto top of wedge.
The 1" thickness doesn't quite give enough angle to get the light perfectly horizontal I don't think, but it's close enough. Some 5/4 teak or mahogany would be enough to fully level it up probably.
FWIW I'm re-mounting my front navigation light (Perko dome bow light) on a round of the same material, replacing a cracked and weathered to death piece of teak previously used to raise the light up off the deck a bit. That was easier, I just cut a round from the same stock with the same hole saw, but no need to cut the wedge/taper first.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 10:31 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
The downward angle seems like a valid concern. That hardly seems coast guard approved ( though they primarily concern them selves with flare expiration and PFDs from what I've experienced). More importantly, hard to expect someone to see it from 2 nautical miles away, and that might be unsafe.
I was thinking the same thing, but I'm having trouble thinking of how to form the wedge. A block of wood and some sandpaper is one option, but it seems like hard work to get the angle and curve right. I was thinking of trying to cut a mold from a yogurt cup and making an epoxy plug, thinking the cup would be easy to form. That seems like a lot of work too. Don't have any yogurt cups anyway; maybe I should just start sanding :).
Did you think of any clever solutions?
Dan Farrell M17 #301
John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
My 74 M17 came with a Perko dome type stern light mounted on the down-sloping part of the port side coaming near the stern.
You can see a similar mounting in some of the pics of "transom rebuild" for "Monita" on the MSOGPhoto site.
Side visibility of the light is probably fine. Visibility of the light would be reduced more directly astern because of the downward slope of the mounting surface.
I will soon be re-mounting mine on a wedge that will level it up (or nearly so). It looks like that was done on "Monita" also, from one of the pics further along in the transom rebuild...?
I thought about switching to a transom mounted one, but given my starting point just leveling it up with a wedge mount seems like most return for least effort. The wiring's already there, the holes are already there, and no issues with rudder and/or motor mount reducing visible angles.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 07:38 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
Hi folks,
My m17 came with no Stern light, and I'd like to add one. I can't figure out where the best location would be - the aft end of the coming seems like it would be a great spot if it was flat. A vertical mount on the transom would be another option.
I'm curious if any list readers have done this and where they put the light, and if they regret their decisions :).
I'm
Dan Farrell M17 #301
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
My mistake on the stern light requirement...the port/starboard (side) lights and stern light requirements are different - 1 NM for sidelights, but 2 NM for stern light. Or, being less than 7m, we can have the handheld light option. Having both is probably a good idea. cheers, John S. On 04/22/2017 09:02 PM, Dan Farrell wrote:
Ah, good call! Starboard seems like a good idea ( why didn't I think of that?) And I bet much more appropriate then wood. A small chunk would probably be cheap, too.
As for the requirements,just because I'm irrationally into colored lights, I'll beg to differ. As far as I can tell, per International and inland navigation rules, rule 22c, vessels less than 12 meters in length, the Stern light, along with masthead, towing, or all-round, is required to be visible to 2 nautical miles. Sidelights are 1 nmi.
Granted, since m17s are less than 7 meters in length, they might arguably fall under the contingency in 25d, having ready at hand a light to show "in sufficient time to prevent collision", but it seems unfair to call it impractical to show the standard lights on an m17.
Maybe I've misinterpreted this? I'm genuinely curious. Not that I think it would ever actually come up, of course. How would the coast guard even measure that?
Dan Farrell M17 #301
John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
The CG only cares that the light is visible as required for the boat it's on; they don't care how it's mounted. For our little boats, 1 NM is all that's required.
I cut a wedge from a piece of 1" kingboard/starboard - in fact from the scrap piece that Dave Scobie generously sent me many many months ago.
More detail - I measured the diameter of the light base (same Perko you have probably) and then cut a wedge from rectangular stock with that diagonal measure on a table saw. Then I took that and cut a round out of it using an appropriately large hole saw (on a drill press, which made it easier to keep the cut perpendicular to what will be the top face of the material).
End result - round wedge that tapers from 1" to zero, diameter about 1/8" bigger than the light base.
I just need to pull the light off and re-mount with the wedge under it. I'll mount the wedge with small machine bolts thru the coaming. Light will screw back onto top of wedge.
The 1" thickness doesn't quite give enough angle to get the light perfectly horizontal I don't think, but it's close enough. Some 5/4 teak or mahogany would be enough to fully level it up probably.
FWIW I'm re-mounting my front navigation light (Perko dome bow light) on a round of the same material, replacing a cracked and weathered to death piece of teak previously used to raise the light up off the deck a bit. That was easier, I just cut a round from the same stock with the same hole saw, but no need to cut the wedge/taper first.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 10:31 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
The downward angle seems like a valid concern. That hardly seems coast guard approved ( though they primarily concern them selves with flare expiration and PFDs from what I've experienced). More importantly, hard to expect someone to see it from 2 nautical miles away, and that might be unsafe.
I was thinking the same thing, but I'm having trouble thinking of how to form the wedge. A block of wood and some sandpaper is one option, but it seems like hard work to get the angle and curve right. I was thinking of trying to cut a mold from a yogurt cup and making an epoxy plug, thinking the cup would be easy to form. That seems like a lot of work too. Don't have any yogurt cups anyway; maybe I should just start sanding :).
Did you think of any clever solutions?
Dan Farrell M17 #301
John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
My 74 M17 came with a Perko dome type stern light mounted on the down-sloping part of the port side coaming near the stern.
You can see a similar mounting in some of the pics of "transom rebuild" for "Monita" on the MSOGPhoto site.
Side visibility of the light is probably fine. Visibility of the light would be reduced more directly astern because of the downward slope of the mounting surface.
I will soon be re-mounting mine on a wedge that will level it up (or nearly so). It looks like that was done on "Monita" also, from one of the pics further along in the transom rebuild...?
I thought about switching to a transom mounted one, but given my starting point just leveling it up with a wedge mount seems like most return for least effort. The wiring's already there, the holes are already there, and no issues with rudder and/or motor mount reducing visible angles.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 07:38 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
Hi folks,
My m17 came with no Stern light, and I'd like to add one. I can't figure out where the best location would be - the aft end of the coming seems like it would be a great spot if it was flat. A vertical mount on the transom would be another option.
I'm curious if any list readers have done this and where they put the light, and if they regret their decisions :).
I'm
Dan Farrell M17 #301
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
FWIW I have posted pictures of how I modified the stern light mounting on Monita on the Msogphotosite in a new technical post. On Sun, Apr 23, 2017 at 11:29 AM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
My mistake on the stern light requirement...the port/starboard (side) lights and stern light requirements are different - 1 NM for sidelights, but 2 NM for stern light. Or, being less than 7m, we can have the handheld light option. Having both is probably a good idea.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 09:02 PM, Dan Farrell wrote:
Ah, good call! Starboard seems like a good idea ( why didn't I think of that?) And I bet much more appropriate then wood. A small chunk would probably be cheap, too.
As for the requirements,just because I'm irrationally into colored lights, I'll beg to differ. As far as I can tell, per International and inland navigation rules, rule 22c, vessels less than 12 meters in length, the Stern light, along with masthead, towing, or all-round, is required to be visible to 2 nautical miles. Sidelights are 1 nmi.
Granted, since m17s are less than 7 meters in length, they might arguably fall under the contingency in 25d, having ready at hand a light to show "in sufficient time to prevent collision", but it seems unfair to call it impractical to show the standard lights on an m17.
Maybe I've misinterpreted this? I'm genuinely curious. Not that I think it would ever actually come up, of course. How would the coast guard even measure that?
Dan Farrell M17 #301
John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
The CG only cares that the light is visible as required for the boat
it's on; they don't care how it's mounted. For our little boats, 1 NM is all that's required.
I cut a wedge from a piece of 1" kingboard/starboard - in fact from the scrap piece that Dave Scobie generously sent me many many months ago.
More detail - I measured the diameter of the light base (same Perko you have probably) and then cut a wedge from rectangular stock with that diagonal measure on a table saw. Then I took that and cut a round out of it using an appropriately large hole saw (on a drill press, which made it easier to keep the cut perpendicular to what will be the top face of the material).
End result - round wedge that tapers from 1" to zero, diameter about 1/8" bigger than the light base.
I just need to pull the light off and re-mount with the wedge under it. I'll mount the wedge with small machine bolts thru the coaming. Light will screw back onto top of wedge.
The 1" thickness doesn't quite give enough angle to get the light perfectly horizontal I don't think, but it's close enough. Some 5/4 teak or mahogany would be enough to fully level it up probably.
FWIW I'm re-mounting my front navigation light (Perko dome bow light) on a round of the same material, replacing a cracked and weathered to death piece of teak previously used to raise the light up off the deck a bit. That was easier, I just cut a round from the same stock with the same hole saw, but no need to cut the wedge/taper first.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 10:31 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
The downward angle seems like a valid concern. That hardly seems coast guard approved ( though they primarily concern them selves with flare expiration and PFDs from what I've experienced). More importantly, hard to expect someone to see it from 2 nautical miles away, and that might be unsafe.
I was thinking the same thing, but I'm having trouble thinking of how to form the wedge. A block of wood and some sandpaper is one option, but it seems like hard work to get the angle and curve right. I was thinking of trying to cut a mold from a yogurt cup and making an epoxy plug, thinking the cup would be easy to form. That seems like a lot of work too. Don't have any yogurt cups anyway; maybe I should just start sanding :).
Did you think of any clever solutions?
Dan Farrell M17 #301
John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
My 74 M17 came with a Perko dome type stern light mounted on the
down-sloping part of the port side coaming near the stern.
You can see a similar mounting in some of the pics of "transom rebuild" for "Monita" on the MSOGPhoto site.
Side visibility of the light is probably fine. Visibility of the light would be reduced more directly astern because of the downward slope of the mounting surface.
I will soon be re-mounting mine on a wedge that will level it up (or nearly so). It looks like that was done on "Monita" also, from one of the pics further along in the transom rebuild...?
I thought about switching to a transom mounted one, but given my starting point just leveling it up with a wedge mount seems like most return for least effort. The wiring's already there, the holes are already there, and no issues with rudder and/or motor mount reducing visible angles.
cheers, John S.
On 04/22/2017 07:38 AM, Dan Farrell wrote:
Hi folks,
My m17 came with no Stern light, and I'd like to add one. I can't figure out where the best location would be - the aft end of the coming seems like it would be a great spot if it was flat. A vertical mount on the transom would be another option.
I'm curious if any list readers have done this and where they put the light, and if they regret their decisions :).
I'm
Dan Farrell M17 #301
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design
- Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design
- Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Henry https://picasaweb.google.com/heinzir
if anyone needs some small pieces of HDPE (ie, generic Starboard) or teak we do have castoff pieces at the shop from building the Sage 17/15/SageCat. let me know the size you are looking for and i'll look in the scrap pile. send me an email at dave@sagemarine.com :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner #288 - http://www.freewebs.com/m15-name-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - http://www.m17-375.webs.com :: Sage 17 #1 - AIR BORN - http://sagemarine.us/sage_17.html :: Sage 15 sloop #001 - ASOLARE - http://sagemarine.us/sage_15.html :: SageCat #000 - SAGECAT - http://sagemarine.us/sagecat.html On Sat, Apr 22, 2017 at 10:02 PM, Dan Farrell <msog@danf.us> wrote: .... A small chunk would probably be cheap, too.
participants (4)
-
Dan Farrell -
Dave Scobie -
Henry Rodriguez -
John Schinnerer