Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary"
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off. That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs. How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now. --Bob BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Bob, I had some glass work done on Busca (cockpit bulkhead instrument holes filled, sink and knotmeter thru-hulls filled) and the guy did a super job and matched the gelcoat perfectly. I've seen repair work that included duplicating sections of non-skid patterns that were even indiscernible with close inspection. That's skill. Unless doing enough of it to warrant the practice (and practice makes perfect), it's probably a whole lot less aggravating to just have a pro do it if you want it to *really look good*. If less than perfection is okay, then the tube of air-dry stuff isn't bad at all. ******* To de-core the centerboard pendant, you just slide the cover braid back to expose the core (start with a raw end, not a melted end), clip off the core the desired amount (enough to thread the cover braid into the board and tie a knot in it), then slide the cover braid back down and seal-melt the end of it to prevent fraying. Piece of cake. Tod M17 #408 BuscaBrisas -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Bob Olson Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 12:01 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off. That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs. How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now. --Bob BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West
System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
I've filled in my M17's Plexi window opening, installed opening ports, moved deck hardware, including my traveler, and even replaced my 3-pintal lifting rudder with a two-pintal kickup ... I've also repaired many nicks and scratches typical to a 20-year-old boat ... All the while having all the work done by a professional, who perfectly matched my gel ... I wouldn't recommend this from the standpoint of cost, but the RESULT: None of the old mounting holes, nicks, scratches, etc. that I have had repaired are detectable ... By ANYONE ... The guy I use is a perfectionist and true artist in fiberglass ... And charges less/hour than marinas ... Nevertheless, I respect the heck out of the do-it-yourselfers on this list who roll up their sleeves and "just do it", gleaning the satisfaction of self-sufficiency and staunching some of the financial hemorrhages of boat-ownership ... However, those of you familiar with my threads know I have physical limitations, so am not capable of some of the DIY ... So, my hat is off to the exceptionally capable individualists on this list who have tackled everything from paint to trailer overhauls to electrical to self-steering ... I wish I were one of you, but I ain't ... ----- Original Message ----- From: htmills@bright.net To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 1:15 PM Subject: Gel Coat Matching Bob, I had some glass work done on Busca (cockpit bulkhead instrument holes filled, sink and knotmeter thru-hulls filled) and the guy did a super job and matched the gelcoat perfectly. I've seen repair work that included duplicating sections of non-skid patterns that were even indiscernible with close inspection. That's skill. Unless doing enough of it to warrant the practice (and practice makes perfect), it's probably a whole lot less aggravating to just have a pro do it if you want it to *really look good*. If less than perfection is okay, then the tube of air-dry stuff isn't bad at all. ******* To de-core the centerboard pendant, you just slide the cover braid back to expose the core (start with a raw end, not a melted end), clip off the core the desired amount (enough to thread the cover braid into the board and tie a knot in it), then slide the cover braid back down and seal-melt the end of it to prevent fraying. Piece of cake. Tod M17 #408 BuscaBrisas -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Bob Olson Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 12:01 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Gel Coat Matching Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off. That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs. How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now. --Bob
On Apr 17, 2005, at 12:01 PM, Bob Olson wrote:
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
Hi Bob, Thought I'd answer right away in case you were in the middle of your project... I haven't spliced braid in a while, but what I remember is that you bend the rope into a tight "U" shape where you want the core to end and the empty shell to begin, then just carefully work a tool in through the outer weave (careful not to snag outer layer) and pull out the core. So you'll have a loop of core coming out through a gap in the cover's weave; then just snip the core and pull it back in to the cover by straightening out the "U." I think that should be it. I'm sure others will chime in if I've remembered it wrong. HTH --- Rachel Former owner M-17 #334 and M-15 #517. Still have Fatty Knees 7', so I'm not totally Hess-less :-)
So many great answers from the group. Including Bob Eeg himself. Pretty cool. Got to say that part of the fun in owning a boat, is figuring out how to do all the stuff you need to know to keep them in good shape. It's a "Zen and the Art of Motorcyle Maintenance"sort of thing--simply good therapy. Thanks for all the advice. --Bob Olson
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process. I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes. Jerry jerrymontgomery.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Jerry, I ended up using Interlux 'Perfection' -- a two part polyurethane--like you mentioned. And it IS shiny. It flowed out smoother than the original gelcoat. I chose it because it comes in a cream color that matches the original gelcoat perfectly. If anything, I might sand it with 2000 grit to cut the sheen a bit. --Bob Olson On Apr 18, 2005, at 9:42 PM, jerry wrote:
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process.
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
That would be PVA (Poly Vinyl Alcohol or the brand name "Part All #10", green liquid) It washes off with water. (not MEK) Bob jerry wrote:
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process.
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along
(West
System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00.
On
page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks
like my
little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However,
they do
recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the
gelcoat finish.
Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
eeyahhyah.... all these letters! alphabet soup! PVA (water soluble polymer) http://encyclopedia.lockergnome.com/s/b/Polyvinyl_alcohol MEK (thinner) http://encyclopedia.lockergnome.com/s/b/Methyl_ethyl_ketone MEKP (polyester resin catalyst) http://encyclopedia.lockergnome.com/s/b/Methyl_ethyl_ketone_peroxide -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces+htmills=bright.net@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Bob Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 7:15 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching That would be PVA (Poly Vinyl Alcohol or the brand name "Part All #10", green liquid) It washes off with water. (not MEK) Bob jerry wrote:
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process.
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along
(West
System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00.
On
page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks
like my
little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However,
they do
recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the
gelcoat finish.
Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
MEKP is the hardner used as the catalyst for polyester and/or polyvinyl resins . Could you have meant polyvinyl alcohol? The books are full of things I don't know about these stuff, so set me straight. Thanks. Clarence Andrews M-17 Carpe Ventum #604 ----- Original Message ----- From: "jerry" <jerry@jerrymontgomery.org> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:42 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process.
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
You are absolutely right! My misteak! I got my catylists and releases mixed up. Jerry jerrymontgomery.org ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clarence Andrews" <n9ca@comcast.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 5:17 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
MEKP is the hardner used as the catalyst for polyester and/or polyvinyl resins . Could you have meant polyvinyl alcohol? The books are full of things I don't know about these stuff, so set me straight. Thanks.
Clarence Andrews M-17 Carpe Ventum #604
----- Original Message ----- From: "jerry" <jerry@jerrymontgomery.org> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2005 12:42 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
MEK Peroxide (methyl ethel keytone) is the water-soluble plastic film that you spray over a gel-coat repair, to keep off the oxygen, which retards the curing process.
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Olson" <bobo4u@qwest.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2005 10:01 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
Bill, From what I've been able to glean from various websites regarding gelcoat, is that its primarily a production process material. In other words, it works best when sprayed into a mold as the first layer in the production process before the layers of fiberglass. I have a feeling that it would be difficult to replicate the original gelcoat look by applying it over a hull repair. And, I'm guessing that it would need to be covered in order to cure properly. Typically, a boat shop would spray a water soluable material over the gelcoat as a final step. After the gelcoat had cured, then the top layer would be washed off.
That's why I'm leaning toward a linear polyurathane (sp?) product. More expensive than cocaine, but it sounds as though it's the right product for post production repairs.
How the hell do you de-core part of a rope for a centerboard pendant? That's the thing that got me boggled right now.
--Bob
BILLAMICASR@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/2005 12:08:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, bobo4u@qwest.net writes: West System believes that you can put gelcoat over their epoxy. Bob, I was about to go buy another book when I had the right one all along (West System Boat Repair & Maintenance). The book is inexpensive, around $3.00. On page 8 it refers to the steps needed to use gelcoat over epoxy. Looks like my little projects will be fine with the use of epoxy only. No need to use polyester resin for the small hole repairs I've got in mind. However, they do recommend a long epoxy cure time of two weeks prior to putting on the gelcoat finish. Bill "Tipperary" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
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So if I want to spiff up my 1978 boat, I should prep it for painting, then take it to an auto body shop and have them shoot on a couple coats of white and some clear cote? And maybe not white. Heck....going the automotive route opens up all kinds of color options. Maybe I could get a deal on Mary-Kay Pink in a metal flake? Wouldn't be too many of those out there! Seriously, if the automotive paint is an option, it changes the equation a great deal. No reason at all to have a ragged looking boat. On my stitch and glue dinghy, I have been planning to use a water based 2 part LPU paint from System 3. Perhaps I should give the automotive paint a try. One of our local auto parts stores has an automotive paint section. Hard to imagine it could be that easy. On 4/18/05 11:42 PM, "jerry" <jerry@jerrymontgomery.org> wrote:
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
Howard, If you choose to use a two part polyurethane paint, check with the manufacturer about its toxicity. The use of some paints require that you be totally covered and use an outside air source for breathing, due to ingredients like isocyanates. There are also basecoat-clear coat types. Don't know what their toxicity is. Clarence ----- Original Message ----- From: "Howard Audsley" <haudsley@tranquility.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 7:04 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Gel Coat Matching
So if I want to spiff up my 1978 boat, I should prep it for painting, then take it to an auto body shop and have them shoot on a couple coats of white and some clear cote? And maybe not white. Heck....going the automotive route opens up all kinds of color options. Maybe I could get a deal on Mary-Kay Pink in a metal flake? Wouldn't be too many of those out there!
Seriously, if the automotive paint is an option, it changes the equation a great deal. No reason at all to have a ragged looking boat.
On my stitch and glue dinghy, I have been planning to use a water based 2 part LPU paint from System 3. Perhaps I should give the automotive paint a try. One of our local auto parts stores has an automotive paint section. Hard to imagine it could be that easy.
On 4/18/05 11:42 PM, "jerry" <jerry@jerrymontgomery.org> wrote:
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you
can
sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
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OK, from my recent centerboard rebuilding experience, here's my personal advice on repairing your Monty and getting it to match the original gelcoat. Use West System Epoxy to repair any fiberglass that needs it. The stuff is amazing. You can thicken it to any consistency that's required by using several different thickening agents. Or you can use it unthickened to lay down fiberglass material. I used their fairing compund to rebuild the leading edge of my centerboard. Then I used a rasp to reshape the edge--best shaping tool there is. Then, I rough sanded the whole thing with 100 grit. Then I encapsulated the repaired edge in a couple of layers of fiberglass using unthickened epoxy. When cured, I used the rasp again to cut off excess, and sanded again with 100 grit and then 200 grit. Wash with water to remove epoxy 'blush'. Then clean the surface with acetone. Now, the best part. I found a product that's easy to use as a final finish layer that matches the gel coat color perfectly. Interlux Perfection--two part polyueuthane--premixed CREAM color. You can get it at West Marine. But here's a link to a supplier's page simply to show you what the product looks like; http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/ak/Paints/Topside_Paint/Interlux_Topsid... I omitted the primer coat and applied it directly over my epoxy repair. A little goes a long, long way. And I found that I could use it straight from the can without using any thinner. You can roll it on and it looks as though it's been spray painted. I used one coat, although it probably could have used two. But that's only because my patch job was a dark color due to the kind of fairing compound I used. Since it was my unseen centerboard, I decided one coat was enough. The main purpose of the coating is to provided UV protection since epoxy will break down in the sun. But keep in mind that epoxy provides a superior moisture barrier and is much stronger than polyester. It takes a couple of days for the Interlux to cure depending on temperature. I applied it in 50 degree weather, although I used a space heater to warm up the centerboard before applying. And I've been reheating it from time to time. It seems to produce a very hard surface now that it's cured for a couple of days. And it's really shiny. I sanded it a bit to knock the sheen down. Be careful out there! Interlux polyurethane fumes are toxic, and it is flamable. Try to apply it outside on a warm, dry, day. And keep the dust down --Bob Olson Howard Audsley wrote:
So if I want to spiff up my 1978 boat, I should prep it for painting, then take it to an auto body shop and have them shoot on a couple coats of white and some clear cote? And maybe not white. Heck....going the automotive route opens up all kinds of color options. Maybe I could get a deal on Mary-Kay Pink in a metal flake? Wouldn't be too many of those out there!
Seriously, if the automotive paint is an option, it changes the equation a great deal. No reason at all to have a ragged looking boat.
On my stitch and glue dinghy, I have been planning to use a water based 2 part LPU paint from System 3. Perhaps I should give the automotive paint a try. One of our local auto parts stores has an automotive paint section. Hard to imagine it could be that easy.
On 4/18/05 11:42 PM, "jerry" <jerry@jerrymontgomery.org> wrote:
I better way on an older boat is to use a two-part polyurethane. Rather than LP (linear polyurethane), an automotive type is better because you can sand out any runs, and it stands up to UV better. You can spray it over gel-coat (prep just like you would when using gel-coat, then wetsand out the edges and buff. It'll be the shiniest spot on the boat, esp[ecially ten years later. The best auto-type polyurethane is Deltron, made by PPG. You can't get it many places now in CA because of harrassment from the air quality people, but it IS still legal for boats and airplanes.
Jerry jerrymontgomery.org
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You get a lot of UV on your centerboard? Perhaps you should reef sooner. Norm
The main purpose of the coating is to provided UV protection since epoxy will break down in the sun. But keep in mind that epoxy provides a superior moisture barrier and is much stronger than polyester.
participants (10)
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BILLAMICASR＠aol.com -
Bob -
Bob Olson -
Clarence Andrews -
Craig F. Honshell -
Howard Audsley -
htmills＠bright.net -
jerry -
Norm Lane -
Rachel