Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported. I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
Hello Max: So you have #277? I'm sailing #278.....and #279 is also on the list Looks like we have that era covered! Water is collecting under the V-berth? Not many places it could come from there except perhaps a knotmeter. Most of those have a thru hull hole, and only an O-ring to seal it. That's the only thru hull I have under the v-berth. There is also a hole for the galley drain under the galley......and if that was leaking, water could move forward to under the v-berth. And of course the eye. There is a false front at the front of the v-berth...between the liner and the hull. But nothing up there should be below the water line to leak. Do you have an access port in the forward part above the v-berth....so you can get at the bow eye nuts? Install a new one with backing plate perhaps? Hull deck joints leak on top of the v-berth. You would see that water and your cushions would be wet. If water is behind the bulkhead on your cabin floor, there is also the cockpit drain to consider, and perhaps the centerboard trunk. Not many other holes where it could come from. As for the transom, that doesn't sound good. If the cabin top has separated from the hull at the transom, and the plywood core has rotted out, I'd fear you are in for a major repair. The transom should not be hollow, except well below the level of the cockpit seats. The top half of the transom....around the motor cutout and where the chainplates bolt on, should be solid core plywood....I'd guess 3/4 inch. I can imagine how to do that repair, but it wouldn't be fun. Howard M17, #278 Audasea On 11/23/04 4:33 PM, "Max Dawson" <mmmdawson80@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported.
I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
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Howard, If you are sailing M17 #278 we should be close friends as the Vin# on Endelig is MMP172790278!! I hope I am correct and not putting my foot in my mouth again. Max, When I got my used M-17 # 278 (I think) she had been moored, unused in a saltwater slip for a number of years. Luckily for me, while doing a clean up, with the boat was on the trailer, I found a lot of water on the sole of the cabin. It turns out that the aluminum cockpit drain-pipe fiber-glassed into the hull was rotten and had literally disintegrated. I put a inspection port in the center of the front of the back seat so I could correct the problem. Check that out, if it is the problem, I would be happy to send you some pictures of my fix. Bill Sylvester M-17 #??? Endelig On Nov 23, 2004, at 3:00 PM, Howard Audsley wrote:
Hello Max:
So you have #277? I'm sailing #278.....and #279 is also on the list Looks like we have that era covered!
Water is collecting under the V-berth? Not many places it could come from there except perhaps a knotmeter. Most of those have a thru hull hole, and only an O-ring to seal it. That's the only thru hull I have under the v-berth. There is also a hole for the galley drain under the galley......and if that was leaking, water could move forward to under the v-berth. And of course the eye. There is a false front at the front of the v-berth...between the liner and the hull. But nothing up there should be below the water line to leak. Do you have an access port in the forward part above the v-berth....so you can get at the bow eye nuts? Install a new one with backing plate perhaps? Hull deck joints leak on top of the v-berth. You would see that water and your cushions would be wet.
If water is behind the bulkhead on your cabin floor, there is also the cockpit drain to consider, and perhaps the centerboard trunk. Not many other holes where it could come from.
As for the transom, that doesn't sound good. If the cabin top has separated from the hull at the transom, and the plywood core has rotted out, I'd fear you are in for a major repair. The transom should not be hollow, except well below the level of the cockpit seats. The top half of the transom....around the motor cutout and where the chainplates bolt on, should be solid core plywood....I'd guess 3/4 inch. I can imagine how to do that repair, but it wouldn't be fun.
Howard M17, #278 Audasea
On 11/23/04 4:33 PM, "Max Dawson" <mmmdawson80@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported.
I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
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Bill: When in doubt always consult the MSOG: http://www.msog.org/specs/hin17.cfm I think you have #279, made in 2-78. Audasea appears to be #278, also made in Feb 1978...maybe even the same day? Jerry was having fun and cranking them out back then. BTW....how did you fix your cockpit drain? Is it now a seacock? Howard On 11/23/04 5:37 PM, "William Sylvester" <wmcsyl1@cox.net> wrote:
Howard,
If you are sailing M17 #278 we should be close friends as the Vin# on Endelig is MMP172790278!! I hope I am correct and not putting my foot in my mouth again.
Max,
When I got my used M-17 # 278 (I think) she had been moored, unused in a saltwater slip for a number of years. Luckily for me, while doing a clean up, with the boat was on the trailer, I found a lot of water on the sole of the cabin. It turns out that the aluminum cockpit drain-pipe fiber-glassed into the hull was rotten and had literally disintegrated. I put a inspection port in the center of the front of the back seat so I could correct the problem. Check that out, if it is the problem, I would be happy to send you some pictures of my fix.
Bill Sylvester M-17 #??? Endelig
On Nov 23, 2004, at 3:00 PM, Howard Audsley wrote:
Hello Max:
So you have #277? I'm sailing #278.....and #279 is also on the list Looks like we have that era covered!
Water is collecting under the V-berth? Not many places it could come from there except perhaps a knotmeter. Most of those have a thru hull hole, and only an O-ring to seal it. That's the only thru hull I have under the v-berth. There is also a hole for the galley drain under the galley......and if that was leaking, water could move forward to under the v-berth. And of course the eye. There is a false front at the front of the v-berth...between the liner and the hull. But nothing up there should be below the water line to leak. Do you have an access port in the forward part above the v-berth....so you can get at the bow eye nuts? Install a new one with backing plate perhaps? Hull deck joints leak on top of the v-berth. You would see that water and your cushions would be wet.
If water is behind the bulkhead on your cabin floor, there is also the cockpit drain to consider, and perhaps the centerboard trunk. Not many other holes where it could come from.
As for the transom, that doesn't sound good. If the cabin top has separated from the hull at the transom, and the plywood core has rotted out, I'd fear you are in for a major repair. The transom should not be hollow, except well below the level of the cockpit seats. The top half of the transom....around the motor cutout and where the chainplates bolt on, should be solid core plywood....I'd guess 3/4 inch. I can imagine how to do that repair, but it wouldn't be fun.
Howard M17, #278 Audasea
On 11/23/04 4:33 PM, "Max Dawson" <mmmdawson80@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported.
I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
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Hello to Howard Audsley, and all the other Montgomery 17 owners. I sent out my first post recently, and have just discovered that I claimed the incorrect hull #. My boat is actually Hull #231, made in 2/77. I hope I haven't caused a problem. I will have to correct my registration as well! Thanks to Howard for reminding me - got in a rush and forgot the numbering scheme. max
Howard, You might check the traveler mounting bolts. Mine had a leak in that location. Ken W. M 17 Mo'Betta ----- Original Message ----- From: "Howard Audsley" <haudsley@tranquility.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 3:00 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Hello from new-old M17 owner
Hello Max:
So you have #277? I'm sailing #278.....and #279 is also on the list Looks like we have that era covered!
Water is collecting under the V-berth? Not many places it could come from there except perhaps a knotmeter. Most of those have a thru hull hole, and only an O-ring to seal it. That's the only thru hull I have under the v-berth. There is also a hole for the galley drain under the galley......and if that was leaking, water could move forward to under the v-berth. And of course the eye. There is a false front at the front of the v-berth...between the liner and the hull. But nothing up there should be below the water line to leak. Do you have an access port in the forward part above the v-berth....so you can get at the bow eye nuts? Install a new one with backing plate perhaps? Hull deck joints leak on top of the v-berth. You would see that water and your cushions would be wet.
If water is behind the bulkhead on your cabin floor, there is also the cockpit drain to consider, and perhaps the centerboard trunk. Not many other holes where it could come from.
As for the transom, that doesn't sound good. If the cabin top has separated from the hull at the transom, and the plywood core has rotted out, I'd fear you are in for a major repair. The transom should not be hollow, except well below the level of the cockpit seats. The top half of the transom....around the motor cutout and where the chainplates bolt on, should be solid core plywood....I'd guess 3/4 inch. I can imagine how to do that repair, but it wouldn't be fun.
Howard M17, #278 Audasea
On 11/23/04 4:33 PM, "Max Dawson" <mmmdawson80@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported.
I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
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Hi Max Congratulations on buying a Monty, as a previous owner you are familiar with them & having bought your second, one don't have to be told what a capable & beautiful boat they are. I have M17 #204 & have the same small leakage you describe although in my case it only leaks when I've been under sail. Have been trying to isolate the cause haven;t had much success yet. a few items I've been thinking might be responsible are: 1. When sailing and the boat heels mightly to port , water might back up the sink drain & either leak thru the hose fitting (or possibly over the top of the sink). Or water may come thru the hull to deck joint. 2. Water may spurt thru the c'board pendant hole, I think others have reported this. Or thru the bolt holes holding my o'board motor mount. 3. When I got my boat the lower gudgeon bolt holes were leaking. I had the same weak transom next to the cutout problem you describe. My solution was remove the gudgeons and reinforce the transom it with a board shaped to fit. You will need to do a little shaping to fit it at the cut out part. The board is about 4" wide & runs from the skeg to the top epoxied to the outside of the transom. One advantage to this is I was able to bolt the gudgeons to the new board (recessing the bolt heads) then epoxy the entire assembly to the stern, eliminating the need for the gudgeon bolts to go thru the hull. Hope this helps, keep me posted of your progress. Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Max Dawson" <mmmdawson80@hotmail.com> To: <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 4:33 PM Subject: M_Boats: Hello from new-old M17 owner
Hello one and all! My name is Max, and I bought an M17 (hull#277) last year site unseen from someone in Texas (I live in Knoxville, TN). I was very happy to discover that the claims written on the MSOG site regarding this boat's sailing ability are true. I sailed on lakes Sabine and Conroe during my visit a few weeks ago, and was pleasantly surprised on both light and heavy wind capability. I purused the archives for some issues that I am experiencing, and so far have not come across answers, so if I am not being too much a bother I will ask them here. 1 - The boat is taking on a little water (around 3-5 gal. on an overnighter), which is collecting under the vee berth area. The bow eye is quite loose, but it appears to be around 12 inches up from the water line. I thought it might have something to do with the scupper lines (they drain very slowly), but if this is the case I would think the cabin sole proper would be wet. Any ideas? 2 - The transom is pushed in at the top some, and appears to be hollow - is this correct? I am wondering about the best way to repair it. It is quite sailable now, but I am concerned, since the top (at the separated area) also has one of the gudgeons. I want to make sure the rudder is sufficiently supported.
I had sent a similar message on 11/19, but used another email address - and the message was rejected on the list. Hope this one goes through OK. Any personal emails may be sent to mdawson at utk.edu Thanks max
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participants (5)
-
Howard Audsley -
Ken Wheeler -
Max Dawson -
Wayne Yeargain -
William Sylvester