Re: M15 Furler Headstay mast connections
I once had a small boat furler that jammed. I like the simplicity of a downhaul. Otherwise most furlers can just stay on the mast when down. Just tie them together. Weight is no issue with a 15. On January 13, 2023, at 10:14 AM, Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote: I'm seriously preparing to begin to commence to start to get a CDI-FF1 furler for the M15 and I'm looking for comments/criticisms My motivation is I currently have a hank-on-reefable-jib which is actually fine for lake sailing, but in the bigger ocean waves, I'd like to have an easier way to reduce the jib...mainly because the wave action makes me reluctant to spend time away from the tiller So I don't intend to keep the furler on the boat, but would rather take it off and replace it with the simple hank-on-forestay which I'lluse about 80% of the time and only 20% use the furler when going on bigger water. So what do you furler guys do when putting the mast back on the trailer? Do you detach it at the mast and slide it up so it doesn't stick out when trailering? What sort of fittings/toggles/turnbuckles do you use? I'm looking at EP sails and precision sails, but what percentage jib/genoa should I go for? I think stock hank-on was 125%, but with a furler, should I go larger because I can always furl it down? Any advice appreciated, including questions I don't even know enough to ask.
I’m sailing a SCAMP now, but the jib issue was a significant problem for me on my M15, so I understand the desire for a furler. I had a jib downhaul setup, and it works for dousing the jib. But with the jib down the boat does not point. So the issue for me was that where I sailed my M15 in Tomales Bay the winds were changeable. I would start out with my working jib. But the wind could come up quickly to gusts of 20 or more, and the working jib was just too much even with the main reefed. Going forward to change jibs in that scenario was just not safe. So, furling would have been the answer had I kept the boat. I would imagine there are others on this list who have furlers who could comment here. Daniel
On Jan 13, 2023, at 7:34 AM, Mike Epp <mike43067@gmail.com> wrote:
I once had a small boat furler that jammed. I like the simplicity of a downhaul. Otherwise most furlers can just stay on the mast when down. Just tie them together. Weight is no issue with a 15.
On January 13, 2023, at 10:14 AM, Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I'm seriously preparing to begin to commence to start to get a CDI-FF1 furler for the M15 and I'm looking for comments/criticisms My motivation is I currently have a hank-on-reefable-jib which is actually fine for lake sailing, but in the bigger ocean waves, I'd like to have an easier way to reduce the jib...mainly because the wave action makes me reluctant to spend time away from the tiller
So I don't intend to keep the furler on the boat, but would rather take it off and replace it with the simple hank-on-forestay which I'lluse about 80% of the time and only 20% use the furler when going on bigger water.
So what do you furler guys do when putting the mast back on the trailer? Do you detach it at the mast and slide it up so it doesn't stick out when trailering? What sort of fittings/toggles/turnbuckles do you use?
I'm looking at EP sails and precision sails, but what percentage jib/genoa should I go for? I think stock hank-on was 125%, but with a furler, should I go larger because I can always furl it down?
Any advice appreciated, including questions I don't even know enough to ask.
Dan has my point exactly. It's not like I haven't been in wind and waves before. I've got 2 reefs in the main and the Jib is reefable, butwhen the waves are big (and I'm talking 5 foot), you just really need a minimal Jib to keep it pointed into the waves or with them. You don't want to let some wave knock you sideways, the the 2nd wave really screws you up. This is even more scary when you are 50 miles from home, 4 miles from shore with a weeks worth of stuff tooand potentially fussing with the engine.. I am scared of the furler jamming, but I'm scared of a lot of things. I guess I think I'll maintain the furlerto make sure it doesn't jam. On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 07:53:10 AM PST, Daniel Rich <danielgrich@gmail.com> wrote: I’m sailing a SCAMP now, but the jib issue was a significant problem for me on my M15, so I understand the desire for a furler. I had a jib downhaul setup, and it works for dousing the jib. But with the jib down the boat does not point. So the issue for me was that where I sailed my M15 in Tomales Bay the winds were changeable. I would start out with my working jib. But the wind could come up quickly to gusts of 20 or more, and the working jib was just too much even with the main reefed. Going forward to change jibs in that scenario was just not safe. So, furling would have been the answer had I kept the boat. I would imagine there are others on this list who have furlers who could comment here. Daniel
On Jan 13, 2023, at 7:34 AM, Mike Epp <mike43067@gmail.com> wrote:
I once had a small boat furler that jammed. I like the simplicity of a downhaul. Otherwise most furlers can just stay on the mast when down. Just tie them together. Weight is no issue with a 15.
On January 13, 2023, at 10:14 AM, Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I'm seriously preparing to begin to commence to start to get a CDI-FF1 furler for the M15 and I'm looking for comments/criticisms My motivation is I currently have a hank-on-reefable-jib which is actually fine for lake sailing, but in the bigger ocean waves, I'd like to have an easier way to reduce the jib...mainly because the wave action makes me reluctant to spend time away from the tiller
So I don't intend to keep the furler on the boat, but would rather take it off and replace it with the simple hank-on-forestay which I'lluse about 80% of the time and only 20% use the furler when going on bigger water.
So what do you furler guys do when putting the mast back on the trailer? Do you detach it at the mast and slide it up so it doesn't stick out when trailering? What sort of fittings/toggles/turnbuckles do you use?
I'm looking at EP sails and precision sails, but what percentage jib/genoa should I go for? I think stock hank-on was 125%, but with a furler, should I go larger because I can always furl it down?
Any advice appreciated, including questions I don't even know enough to ask.
Got it- you are pushing your m15 harder than most of us! For a situation like that, I've wondered about a freestanding storm jib that could be set from the cockpit (no hanks- just tension the luff with the halyard). You'd need a second halyard and a block on the bow to be able to run a tack line back to the cockpit- but seems like you could then pull the tack of the storm jib out to the bow, rig the sheets, douse the normal jib, and then pull that hayard as tight as you can and you'd be set, without all the windage and weight aloft a furler adds in extreme conditions. Curious if anyone has tried such a set up? Or maybe this is still more fiddle faddle than you can deal with in the scenario you describe? Alex On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 9:56 AM Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
Dan has my point exactly.
It's not like I haven't been in wind and waves before. I've got 2 reefs in the main and the Jib is reefable, butwhen the waves are big (and I'm talking 5 foot), you just really need a minimal Jib to keep it pointed into the waves or with them. You don't want to let some wave knock you sideways, the the 2nd wave really screws you up. This is even more scary when you are 50 miles from home, 4 miles from shore with a weeks worth of stuff tooand potentially fussing with the engine..
I am scared of the furler jamming, but I'm scared of a lot of things. I guess I think I'll maintain the furlerto make sure it doesn't jam.
On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 07:53:10 AM PST, Daniel Rich < danielgrich@gmail.com> wrote:
I’m sailing a SCAMP now, but the jib issue was a significant problem for me on my M15, so I understand the desire for a furler. I had a jib downhaul setup, and it works for dousing the jib. But with the jib down the boat does not point. So the issue for me was that where I sailed my M15 in Tomales Bay the winds were changeable. I would start out with my working jib. But the wind could come up quickly to gusts of 20 or more, and the working jib was just too much even with the main reefed. Going forward to change jibs in that scenario was just not safe. So, furling would have been the answer had I kept the boat. I would imagine there are others on this list who have furlers who could comment here.
Daniel
On Jan 13, 2023, at 7:34 AM, Mike Epp <mike43067@gmail.com> wrote:
I once had a small boat furler that jammed. I like the simplicity of a downhaul. Otherwise most furlers can just stay on the mast when down. Just tie them together. Weight is no issue with a 15.
On January 13, 2023, at 10:14 AM, Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I'm seriously preparing to begin to commence to start to get a CDI-FF1 furler for the M15 and I'm looking for comments/criticisms My motivation is I currently have a hank-on-reefable-jib which is actually fine for lake sailing, but in the bigger ocean waves, I'd like to have an easier way to reduce the jib...mainly because the wave action makes me reluctant to spend time away from the tiller
So I don't intend to keep the furler on the boat, but would rather take it off and replace it with the simple hank-on-forestay which I'lluse about 80% of the time and only 20% use the furler when going on bigger water.
So what do you furler guys do when putting the mast back on the trailer? Do you detach it at the mast and slide it up so it doesn't stick out when trailering? What sort of fittings/toggles/turnbuckles do you use?
I'm looking at EP sails and precision sails, but what percentage jib/genoa should I go for? I think stock hank-on was 125%, but with a furler, should I go larger because I can always furl it down?
Any advice appreciated, including questions I don't even know enough to ask.
Sure that could work. on my "reefable" jib (I guess that's my best name for it)., you roll/bunch up the bottom of the jib, making it smaller. Someone suggested that this could be done by adding another line to just pull the jib down, kind of like just using the top of the jib as the "storm jib". But you still have to change the jib sheets. It's not too much fiddle-faddle and if furlers didn't exist, that's the sort of thing I would be looking at. On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 11:10:34 AM PST, Alex Conley <conley.alex@gmail.com> wrote: Got it- you are pushing your m15 harder than most of us! For a situation like that, I've wondered about a freestanding storm jib that could be set from the cockpit (no hanks- just tension the luff with the halyard). You'd need a second halyard and a block on the bow to be able to run a tack line back to the cockpit- but seems like you could then pull the tack of the storm jib out to the bow, rig the sheets, douse the normal jib, and then pull that hayard as tight as you can and you'd be set, without all the windage and weight aloft a furler adds in extreme conditions. Curious if anyone has tried such a set up? Or maybe this is still more fiddle faddle than you can deal with in the scenario you describe? Alex On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 9:56 AM Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
Dan has my point exactly.
It's not like I haven't been in wind and waves before. I've got 2 reefs in the main and the Jib is reefable, butwhen the waves are big (and I'm talking 5 foot), you just really need a minimal Jib to keep it pointed into the waves or with them. You don't want to let some wave knock you sideways, the the 2nd wave really screws you up. This is even more scary when you are 50 miles from home, 4 miles from shore with a weeks worth of stuff tooand potentially fussing with the engine..
I am scared of the furler jamming, but I'm scared of a lot of things. I guess I think I'll maintain the furlerto make sure it doesn't jam.
On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 07:53:10 AM PST, Daniel Rich < danielgrich@gmail.com> wrote:
I’m sailing a SCAMP now, but the jib issue was a significant problem for me on my M15, so I understand the desire for a furler. I had a jib downhaul setup, and it works for dousing the jib. But with the jib down the boat does not point. So the issue for me was that where I sailed my M15 in Tomales Bay the winds were changeable. I would start out with my working jib. But the wind could come up quickly to gusts of 20 or more, and the working jib was just too much even with the main reefed. Going forward to change jibs in that scenario was just not safe. So, furling would have been the answer had I kept the boat. I would imagine there are others on this list who have furlers who could comment here.
Daniel
On Jan 13, 2023, at 7:34 AM, Mike Epp <mike43067@gmail.com> wrote:
I once had a small boat furler that jammed. I like the simplicity of a downhaul. Otherwise most furlers can just stay on the mast when down. Just tie them together. Weight is no issue with a 15.
On January 13, 2023, at 10:14 AM, Lawrence Winiarski via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I'm seriously preparing to begin to commence to start to get a CDI-FF1 furler for the M15 and I'm looking for comments/criticisms My motivation is I currently have a hank-on-reefable-jib which is actually fine for lake sailing, but in the bigger ocean waves, I'd like to have an easier way to reduce the jib...mainly because the wave action makes me reluctant to spend time away from the tiller
So I don't intend to keep the furler on the boat, but would rather take it off and replace it with the simple hank-on-forestay which I'lluse about 80% of the time and only 20% use the furler when going on bigger water.
So what do you furler guys do when putting the mast back on the trailer? Do you detach it at the mast and slide it up so it doesn't stick out when trailering? What sort of fittings/toggles/turnbuckles do you use?
I'm looking at EP sails and precision sails, but what percentage jib/genoa should I go for? I think stock hank-on was 125%, but with a furler, should I go larger because I can always furl it down?
Any advice appreciated, including questions I don't even know enough to ask.
participants (4)
-
Alex Conley -
Daniel Rich -
Lawrence Winiarski -
Mike Epp