Dan, and for those shopping for an M17, Here is as summary of the history of the M17, best I know. The early M17's (from the mid-70's through about 1983) have a cast iron centerboard and used the original deck mold which has a different non-skid pattern, recessed forward hatch, lower cabin top, and single drain in the rear-floor of the cockpit which exits below the waterline. These boats also have a very nice aluminum toe rail, but no Genoa track. These early M17's used a transom cutout for the outboard motor. In 1983 a newer deck was introduced (same deck mold as is being used today, except for the cockpit drain configuration). The new deck incorporated a different cockpit locker configuration of port - starboard - and transom wet locker, two cockpit drains (these feed first into the wet locker and then exit below the waterline, + 2 drains above waterline in the transom). I believe in 1983 there was a fiberglass pan added to the bow section of the inside of the hull to create several flat surfaces for storage. The aluminum toe rail was replaced with a teak toe rail. Also, the windows were changed to frameless smoked fiberglass, in lieu of earlier framed glass(?) windows. Many of this vintage also came with a fixed fiberglass motor mount. In 1988 (roughly at hull #400) the centerboard was changed from 220 lbs cast iron to the same centerboard as is used in the M15, weighing 40 lbs. The M15 is comprised of a fiberglass-lead-fiberglass sandwich and does not require a winch to raise and lower. Also, the ballast was increased to compensate for the change in centerboard weight, and the ballast was changed from steel punching to lead. These changes took places over several boats. For example; our 1988 M17 #410 has the fiberglass centerboard but steel punching ballast. This run continued until Jerry quit building boats in roughly 1994. In the Jerry built boats three interiors were available; 3-berth galley model, 4-berth model, and 3-1/2 berth model. On the galley and 3-1/2 berth models the port cockpit locker opens to the interior of the boat. On the 4-berth model none of the lockers open into the interior of the boat. Since the year 2000 Bob has been building new M17's. To my knowledge these use the same deck and hull molds as the 1983 and newer boats. From the new M17's I've seen I have noted these changes. The below waterline cockpit drains were eliminated and replaced with through the transom above waterline drains, the old style mast-section compression post was replaced with a stainless steel tube, the forestay is moved back slightly off the bow to allow room for a nav light, gelcoat boot and sheer stripes were replaced with vinyl decal stripes, and the spreaders are now fixed instead of folding. The outboard bracket was upgraded to a 4cycle ready adjustable mount. And the forward vberth cushion is 1 piece instead of the 2 used on earlier boats. I've seen pictures of new M17's being built with oval/round opening cabin windows, nice touch! Each model has its own advantages and disadvantages, but all are great boats! Bill's photo site has great pictures of all the variations http://www.msogphotosite.com/index.html , and http://sailing.bobstaco.com has some detailed pictures of the rebuild of our 1988 4-berth model. Randy G. ________________________________________ From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Gary M Hyde [gmhyde1@mac.com] Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 2:47 PM To: danielarichman@gmail.com; For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Removing M17 Galley Dan: Are you aware of the two major different centerboard designs in the M17? The earlier cast iron board and the later fiberglass board and greater fixed ballast? Randy Graves can give you the transition date. --Gary Hyde 2005 M17 sailboat #637 'Hydeaway 2' On Nov 8, 2008, at 9:12 PM, Dan Richman wrote:

I am in very much the market for a Montgomery 17, but in two weeks of intensive searching have turned up only models that have the galley. Today, having actually sat inside an M17 for the first time, my wife and I realized the galley model will not accommodate us. There is simply no room for two people to sit face-to-face, and we consider that a requirement.

That leaves us three choices: (1) continuing to search for a non- galley model, (2) order a new boat, or (3) remove the galley from a galley model.

I would welcome this group's opinions as the wisdom, feasibility and cost of of Option 3: removing the galley from a galley model.

I imagine replacing the galley assembly with a horizontal length of fiberglass that would mirror the starboard side in appearance and function.

I've found nothing in the archives about this. If I've missed a thread, forgive me.

Thanks very much for your collective wisdom.

Dan and Jo Marie Richman Shoreline (Seattle), Wash. _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats

We can't change the wind, but we can trim our sails. Sailing is like "African Queening" thru life. _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats