In a message dated 3/23/2005 5:53:33 AM Pacific Standard Time, doug_kelch@yahoo.com writes: I have the same swim ladder that Tod shows in his picture. It works ok but doesn't get very deep in the water and can be strain getting on that first step. If I had to do it over again I would go for the Telescoping model tha Maria suggests. Thanks Doug, Maria to the rescue again... I'm looking into the ladder that IM puts on their P-19. I've Emailed Windline to see if they are the supplier. However, they dont mention the 4 step transom mount on their site << http://www.windline.com/index.html >> If I were 25, I'd put a good handhold on the stern and just pop out of the water into the cockpit. Seeing as how I don't do much popping any longer, I do like the idea of a ladder that extends well below the waterline. Bill M-17 "Tipperary"