Richard, Good framework for reviewing. I like your description of levels of magic competence: Amateur (Raven) Low Level Professional (better than Raven, less powerful than company wizards) Professional (One Eye, Goblin, Silent, and Tom-Tom) Good Professional (Smoke) Great (The Circle of 18, New Taken) Great with Experience (The Ten Who Were Taken) Extremely Great (Dominator, Lady) In my opinion, a good gaming system would make it possible, with a great deal of play, to get to the Great level; but only epic-level play should get to the Great with Experience level, and the Extremely Great should be on a par with demigods. (Well, the Dominator was, essentially, a demigod; Lady, however, was much less than that.) What would be interesting would be a system that allows one to craft one's own spells, as the Company wizards did. I've just started playing Fantasy Hero, where all spells have to be crafted by the players; it's a helluva lotta work, frankly. Could one combine a Fantasy-Hero kind of magic system with a d20 framework? I'm not sure. Steve/Stacey