Re: [Fractint] We're still alive and well at Fractal Central
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks. I guess Jim's choice to turn to the "irrational" side of the Force is his. ;) David W. Jones gnome@hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.comOn Oct 27, 2016 15:07, John Wilson <1stdiscus@gmail.com> wrote:
Really? "I find it easier to believe than something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night."
How about--- http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/simon-beck-snow-art
One guy only! He hasn't enlisted any unknowns either.
John W.
On 27 October 2016 at 11:49, Jim Muth <jimmuth@earthlink.net> wrote:
Fractal fans of years past:
We're still alive and kicking here at Fractal Central, but things have not been going too well in the past couple months. To start, we found a one week old abandoned kitten in the fractal yard on July 31, which we bottle fed until it was old enough to take care of itself. Then the oldest fractal cat, Nicholas, passed away on September 27, and we decided to keep the orphan kitten, which is a little girl we named Riley. The new girl is now 14 weeks old and learning how to get along with the established cats, Jasmine and Lida. But being raised by humans, she does not yet know how to properly interact with other cats, and some occasional hissing and growling still occurs.
As for the fractals, I am still very interested in them, but I am also becoming quite interested in things that are not totally rational, such as alien abductions, crop circles, bigfoots, hauntings and other things widely considered paranormal. I have never seen a convincing image of an alien, ghost or bigfoot on a TV show, but crop circles definitely have existed. The photos are plentiful, and despite the claims that they are all hoaxes, which appears to satisfy skeptics, I find it easier to believe that something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night.
Perhaps the most intriguing thing of all I have gotten into is the furor between materialists and idealists over the meaning of the quantum discoveries of the past almost 100 years as they apply to the everyday world. I see materialists defending their position that the material world is real, while idealists are claiming that material is an illusion created by the mind, a belief that supports the mystical claims of eastern religions. Since no one really understands the quantum, both sides can spin the quantum discoveries and results of experiments to make it appear as their own theory of reality is true, but to me at least, it appears that the materialist side is doing the greater amount of spinning. I also notice that materialists are quicker to slip into anger and launch ad hominem attacks when they have no real rebuttal of idealist claims. To me this is how people react when they begin to doubt their own beliefs.
Then again, maybe it's all a tempest in a teapot . . .
Jim M.
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David wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks
I just returned from a visit to NYC for the first time in 35 years. The visit to the 911 memorial was certainly an intense experience. While not exactly a fractal, a giant twisted beam in the basement had assumed a shape I found strange indeed. The rectangle-based structure of the beam built originally straight from Plato's world of forms had morphed into multiple twists and loops under forces beyond imagination. The result was a sculpture that looked more from nature than human imagination. Manhatten itself can be seen, from one perspective, as a fractal. I asked about the distribution of the buildings and skyscrapers. While possibly true once, the oft-repeated claim that the sturdy New York bedrock is what permitted the over-scale buildings, I was told that the truth of the matter is that these days a skyscraper can be built on a swamp, and that the force distributing buildings large and small over the island was the aggregate of many financial decisions by developers over the centuries. My condolences also to Jim concerning the fractal cat. Tim On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 8:54 PM, David Jones <gnome@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks. I guess Jim's choice to turn to the "irrational" side of the Force is his. ;)
David W. Jones gnome@hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.comOn Oct 27, 2016 15:07, John Wilson < 1stdiscus@gmail.com> wrote:
Really? "I find it easier to believe than something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night."
How about--- http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/simon-beck-
snow-art
One guy only! He hasn't enlisted any unknowns either.
John W.
On 27 October 2016 at 11:49, Jim Muth <jimmuth@earthlink.net> wrote:
Fractal fans of years past:
We're still alive and kicking here at Fractal Central, but things have not been going too well in the past couple months. To start, we found a one week old abandoned kitten in the fractal yard on July 31, which we bottle fed until it was old enough to take care of itself. Then the oldest fractal cat, Nicholas, passed away on September 27, and we decided to keep the orphan kitten, which is a little girl we named Riley. The new girl is now 14 weeks old and learning how to get along with the established cats, Jasmine and Lida. But being raised by humans, she does not yet know how to properly interact with other cats, and some occasional hissing and growling still occurs.
As for the fractals, I am still very interested in them, but I am also becoming quite interested in things that are not totally rational, such as alien abductions, crop circles, bigfoots, hauntings and other things widely considered paranormal. I have never seen a convincing image of an alien, ghost or bigfoot on a TV show, but crop circles definitely have existed. The photos are plentiful, and despite the claims that they are all hoaxes, which appears to satisfy skeptics, I find it easier to believe that something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night.
Perhaps the most intriguing thing of all I have gotten into is the furor between materialists and idealists over the meaning of the quantum discoveries of the past almost 100 years as they apply to the everyday world. I see materialists defending their position that the material world is real, while idealists are claiming that material is an illusion created by the mind, a belief that supports the mystical claims of eastern religions. Since no one really understands the quantum, both sides can spin the quantum discoveries and results of experiments to make it appear as their own theory of reality is true, but to me at least, it appears that the materialist side is doing the greater amount of spinning. I also notice that materialists are quicker to slip into anger and launch ad hominem attacks when they have no real rebuttal of idealist claims. To me this is how people react when they begin to doubt their own beliefs.
Then again, maybe it's all a tempest in a teapot . . .
Jim M.
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"I was told that the truth of the matter is that these days a skyscraper can be built on a swamp, and that the force distributing buildings large and small over the island was the aggregate of many financial decisions by developers over the centuries." Interesting to see this discussion here. In fact, very much in the news in the San Francisco Bay Area is the Millennium tower that was completed in 2009. It does not have a foundation that goes to bedrock. It has 58 stories and a foundation that goes ~80 feet into bay-fill that can liquefy in an earthquake. It has been sinking at a much faster rate than predicted and is now tilting. They are claiming that it is still safe in an earthquake. My medium-sized wood frame house near the Hayward fault has concrete piers that go 14-24' into the ground, into bedrock. http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/As-charges-fly-in-SF-tests-begin-... http://sf.curbed.com/2016/9/16/12945600/why-millennium-tower-sinking Kathy Roth ----- Original Message ----- From: "Timothy Wegner" <tim@tswegner.net> To: "Fractint and General Fractals Discussion" <fractint@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2016 7:37:23 PM Subject: Re: [Fractint] We're still alive and well at Fractal Central David wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks
I just returned from a visit to NYC for the first time in 35 years. The visit to the 911 memorial was certainly an intense experience. While not exactly a fractal, a giant twisted beam in the basement had assumed a shape I found strange indeed. The rectangle-based structure of the beam built originally straight from Plato's world of forms had morphed into multiple twists and loops under forces beyond imagination. The result was a sculpture that looked more from nature than human imagination. Manhatten itself can be seen, from one perspective, as a fractal. I asked about the distribution of the buildings and skyscrapers. While possibly true once, the oft-repeated claim that the sturdy New York bedrock is what permitted the over-scale buildings, I was told that the truth of the matter is that these days a skyscraper can be built on a swamp, and that the force distributing buildings large and small over the island was the aggregate of many financial decisions by developers over the centuries. My condolences also to Jim concerning the fractal cat. Tim On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 8:54 PM, David Jones <gnome@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks. I guess Jim's choice to turn to the "irrational" side of the Force is his. ;)
David W. Jones gnome@hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.comOn Oct 27, 2016 15:07, John Wilson < 1stdiscus@gmail.com> wrote:
Really? "I find it easier to believe than something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night."
How about--- http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/simon-beck-
snow-art
One guy only! He hasn't enlisted any unknowns either.
John W.
On 27 October 2016 at 11:49, Jim Muth <jimmuth@earthlink.net> wrote:
Fractal fans of years past:
We're still alive and kicking here at Fractal Central, but things have not been going too well in the past couple months. To start, we found a one week old abandoned kitten in the fractal yard on July 31, which we bottle fed until it was old enough to take care of itself. Then the oldest fractal cat, Nicholas, passed away on September 27, and we decided to keep the orphan kitten, which is a little girl we named Riley. The new girl is now 14 weeks old and learning how to get along with the established cats, Jasmine and Lida. But being raised by humans, she does not yet know how to properly interact with other cats, and some occasional hissing and growling still occurs.
As for the fractals, I am still very interested in them, but I am also becoming quite interested in things that are not totally rational, such as alien abductions, crop circles, bigfoots, hauntings and other things widely considered paranormal. I have never seen a convincing image of an alien, ghost or bigfoot on a TV show, but crop circles definitely have existed. The photos are plentiful, and despite the claims that they are all hoaxes, which appears to satisfy skeptics, I find it easier to believe that something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night.
Perhaps the most intriguing thing of all I have gotten into is the furor between materialists and idealists over the meaning of the quantum discoveries of the past almost 100 years as they apply to the everyday world. I see materialists defending their position that the material world is real, while idealists are claiming that material is an illusion created by the mind, a belief that supports the mystical claims of eastern religions. Since no one really understands the quantum, both sides can spin the quantum discoveries and results of experiments to make it appear as their own theory of reality is true, but to me at least, it appears that the materialist side is doing the greater amount of spinning. I also notice that materialists are quicker to slip into anger and launch ad hominem attacks when they have no real rebuttal of idealist claims. To me this is how people react when they begin to doubt their own beliefs.
Then again, maybe it's all a tempest in a teapot . . .
Jim M.
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Hi I live in New Zealand , where there are major fault lines around the country. The Christchurch earthquake that made the news a few years ago was quite devastating ; problems with liquefaction , in the suburbs persist through to the present. The inner city was built upon basaltic rock , nevertheless there was widespread damage to new and old buildings alike. Prior to the earthquake various oil companies were using horizontal drilling in an attempt to find oil and gas deposits. Of course earthquake fissures assume a fractal pattern. If you've ever read about Nikola . Tesla then you might appreciate how he was dealing with fractal objects ; like the electrical discharges that he was so well known for. Sciwise On 28/10/2016 16:48, Kathleen Roth wrote:
"I was told that the truth of the matter is that these days a skyscraper can be built on a swamp, and that the force distributing buildings large and small over the island was the aggregate of many financial decisions by developers over the centuries."
Interesting to see this discussion here. In fact, very much in the news in the San Francisco Bay Area is the Millennium tower that was completed in 2009. It does not have a foundation that goes to bedrock. It has 58 stories and a foundation that goes ~80 feet into
bay-fill that can liquefy in an earthquake. It has been sinking at
a much faster rate than predicted and is now tilting. They are claiming that it is still safe in an earthquake. My medium-sized wood frame house near the Hayward fault has concrete piers that go 14-24' into the ground, into bedrock.
http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/As-charges-fly-in-SF-tests-begin-... [12]
http://sf.curbed.com/2016/9/16/12945600/why-millennium-tower-sinking [13]
Kathy Roth
----- Original Message ----- From: "Timothy
Wegner"
To: "Fractint and General Fractals Discussion" Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2016 7:37:23 PM Subject: Re: [Fractint] We're still alive and well at Fractal Central
David wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks
I just returned from a visit to NYC for the first time in 35 years. The
visit to the 911 memorial was certainly an intense experience. While not
exactly a fractal, a giant twisted beam in the basement had assumed a shape I found strange indeed. The rectangle-based structure of the beam built originally straight from Plato's world of forms had morphed into multiple twists and loops under forces beyond imagination. The result was a sculpture that looked more from nature than human imagination.
Manhatten itself can be seen, from one perspective, as a fractal. I asked about the distribution of the buildings and skyscrapers. While possibly true once, the oft-repeated claim that the sturdy New York bedrock is what permitted the over-scale buildings, I was told that the truth of the matter is that these days a skyscraper can be built on a swamp, and that the force
distributing buildings large and small over the island was the aggregate of
many financial decisions by developers over the centuries.
My condolences also to Jim concerning the fractal cat.
Tim
On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 8:54 PM, David Jones wrote:
Everyone has their own personal PTSD reaction to the 9/11/01 WTC attacks. I guess Jim's choice to turn to the "irrational" side of the Force is his. ;) David W. Jones gnome@hawaii.rr.com [7] authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.comOn [8] Oct 27, 2016 15:07, John Wilson < 1stdiscus@gmail.com [9]> wrote:
Really? "I find it easier to believe than something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night." How about--- http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/simon-beck- [1] snow-art
One guy only! He hasn't enlisted any unknowns either. John W. On 27 October 2016 at 11:49, Jim Muth wrote:
Fractal fans of years past: We're still alive and kicking here at Fractal Central, but things have not been going too well in the past couple months. To start, we found a one week old abandoned kitten in the fractal yard on July 31, which we bottle fed until it was old enough to take care of itself. Then the oldest fractal cat, Nicholas, passed away on September 27, and we decided to keep the orphan kitten, which is a little girl we named Riley. The new girl is now 14 weeks old and learning how to get along with the established cats, Jasmine and Lida. But being raised by humans, she does not yet know how to properly interact with other cats, and some occasional hissing and growling still occurs. As for the fractals, I am still very interested in them, but I am also becoming quite interested in things that are not totally rational, such as alien abductions, crop circles, bigfoots, hauntings and other things widely considered paranormal. I have never seen a convincing image of an alien, ghost or bigfoot on a TV show, but crop circles definitely have existed. The photos are plentiful, and despite the claims that they are all hoaxes, which appears to satisfy skeptics, I find it easier to believe that something unknown is creating the more intricate of these formations other than a couple guys with boards or groups who show that at least the more simple circles could be done by humans in one night. Perhaps the most intriguing thing of all I have gotten into is the furor between materialists and idealists over the meaning of the quantum discoveries of the past almost 100 years as they apply to the everyday world. I see materialists defending their position that the material world is real, while idealists are claiming that material is an illusion created by the mind, a belief that supports the mystical claims of eastern religions. Since no one really understands the quantum, both sides can spin the quantum discoveries and results of experiments to make it appear as their own theory of reality is true, but to me at least, it appears that the materialist side is doing the greater amount of spinning. I also notice that materialists are quicker to slip into anger and launch ad hominem attacks when they have no real rebuttal of idealist claims. To me this is how people react when they begin to doubt their own beliefs. Then again, maybe it's all a tempest in a teapot . . . Jim M. _______________________________________________ Fractint mailing list Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [2] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [3]
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https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [20] Links: ------ [1] http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/simon-beck- [2] mailto:Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [3] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [4] mailto:jimmuth@earthlink.net [5] mailto:Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [6] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [7] mailto:gnome@hawaii.rr.com [8] http://dancingtreefrog.comOn [9] mailto:1stdiscus@gmail.com [10] mailto:Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [11] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [12] http://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/As-charges-fly-in-SF-tests-begin-... [13] http://sf.curbed.com/2016/9/16/12945600/why-millennium-tower-sinking [14] mailto:tim@tswegner.net [15] mailto:fractint@mailman.xmission.com [16] mailto:gnome@hawaii.rr.com [17] mailto:Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [18] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint [19] mailto:Fractint@mailman.xmission.com [20] https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fractint
participants (4)
-
David Jones -
Kathleen Roth -
sciwise＠ihug.co.nz -
Timothy Wegner